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Exposing the underbelly of Armstrongism in all of its wacky glory! Nothing you read here is made up. Every crazy, weird and wacky quote is straight from the pens of Armstrongite leaders or members who think they possess some insight into God and the Bible. What you read here is the up to date face of Herbert W Armstrong's legacy. It's the gritty and dirty behind the scenes look at Armstrongism as you have never seen it before!

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    The Eternal Church of God is one of the many hundreds of little splinter personality cults that has popped up over the decades.   It is also one of the more uber-legalistc groups out there that seeks to control much of everything its members do, in much the same way that James Malm does with his Pharisaical lies.

    One of the ECG biggest pet peeves is COG members who dare to eat out on the Sabbath.  This is utter blasphemy and is equivalent to jabbing the spear into Christ's side at the crucifixion.  Every time you eat out on Saturdays, God puts another black mark in your book of life. There can be no greater blasphemy.

    Apparently Eve ate that apple on the Sabbath and when you eat out at Denny's on the Sabbath you too shall die.
    Nearly 6,000 years ago Satan told Eve to disobey God and “you will not surely die” (Gen. 3:4). She ate the forbidden fruit and ultimately perished. Today there are some who teach God’s people that it is acceptable to go to restaurants on the Sabbath. In other words, eat and you won’t die. However, God clearly stated that if we choose to violate His Sabbath we will pay the ultimate consequence. 
    Having a Big Mac is also condemned by Nehemiah:

    Engaging in business with food services, as either the retailer or the consumer, is the very conduct that inspired Nehemiah’s righteous indignation. With this in mind, here is a question to consider. Would Nehemiah think differently about buying and selling today? 
    Later this comment is made:
    Those who dine out on the Sabbath are breaking every aspect of God’s command with respect to eating and resting on His sacred day. Consider what they do. They acquire food on the Sabbath. They have it prepared for them on the Sabbath. They go outside the community of faith to procure the food as well as to consume it. Then they engage in a business transaction by paying for the meal and tipping the server. Tragically, many of God’s people rationalize every one of these practices. Even more tragic is the fate that awaits them if they fail to repent of this sin. 
    Yep, the lake of fire is ready to fry those poor hapless fools that stop by In-n-Out for a burger.

    Those that dare to eat out are accepting the Mark of the Beast.

    The question is which mark do we carry? One of the most obvious displays of God’s mark is our behavior on the Sabbath. The Church of God must realize that when people choose to frequent restaurants they are rejecting God’s authority, they are refusing to accept His mark, and giving way to the mark of the beast! 
    Then they attempt to use Jesus, that most inconvenient man to ever confront the Church of God.  Jesus obviously would have cooked for his family, but the New testament never mentions that he did, therefore you should not cook for yours on Saturdays!   That is perfect Church of God logic for you!
    Although Jesus undoubtedly provided meals for His family during His lifetime on earth, there is no example of Him doing so in the New Testament. However, one example does appear in the Old Covenant that speaks volumes about how God approaches that which is holy. 
    Herbert Armstrong never considered eating out on Saturdays to be an issue.  Nor did he feel it was an issue to pay his cooks to cook him breakfast, lunch and dinner on Friday nights and Saturdays.  This is a major burr under the saddle of professional Judaizer's like James Malm and the ECG.  To get around that mess the ECG attempts to blame lazy ministers for starting the trend.

    Members once knew that eating at a restaurant on the Sabbath was wrong, but many have compromised this truth. It occurred slowly at first. The ministry once suggested that there might be times when eating out on the Sabbath was appropriate. No doctrinal studies were done, no papers were produced, and no official changes were ever made. As time went on, more and more people began dining out with greater frequency. Men began to take their wives out to dinner Friday night. Eventually this practice became habitual. 
    Then the ECG tries to explain how Herbert Armstrong was wrong and he had been "tripped up" by a question he had never had time to think about, take to the Council of Elders for advice, nor have time to study deeply into at home...or apparently at the library in Eugene, OR.
    One large organization published an article stating that dining out on the Sabbath has always received a stamp of approval by the Church. They claim that the Church of God has “consistently taught that eating in a restaurant on the Sabbath was permissible.” In an attempt to justify this belief, they quote Mr. Armstrong who said the following prior to a Bible study. 
    “Now if you go out to a restaurant on the Sabbath, that restaurant is going to be there and that food is going to be prepared whether you go or not and the other people are going to be working anyway. They don’t keep the Sabbath. They pay no attention to that. Now I had never thought until .this evening when the question was brought up to me about whether it’s wrong to go to a restaurant to eat. I know when I travel, I have to do it or do without. And so I do.” 
    Before anyone can claim that Mr. Armstrong approved of this practice, we must first understand the context of his statement. When asked about this issue, it was five minutes prior to a Bible study he was to give on a separate subject. His reply came from an “off the cuff” perspective. He did not take the question home and study it before responding. He did not present it to the council of Elders and produce an article to the Church changing this doctrine. This fact is obvious from the words “I had never thought until this evening when the question was brought up...” 
    In addition, Mr. Armstrong traveled the world visiting various leaders and dignitaries. In his case, he believed it was necessary to occasionally visit restaurants during the Sabbath or he would have to do without any food. Therefore, because he did it on occasion, he felt that it was probably permissible under certain circumstances. His unusual set of circumstances likely motivated his statement. However, over the years, these words led many brethren to believe that they can do business at a restaurant any time they want. This is simply human error. 
    We must recognize that the only man who was ever perfect was Christ. While Mr. Armstrong was an apostle, he was not faultless. All of the apostles have made mistakes. 
    God's apostle obviously made a mistake, even though Jesus personally worked through him 24/7.  The dance that COG member make to get around things and justify their stances are actually quit comical at times.
    In like manner, the apostle of our age modified his teachings as he came to a more complete understanding. Over decades he made changes to the church position on the doctrines of government, the destiny of mankind, divorce, remarriage, and Pentecost.
    The Church of God is one of the only churches that admits wrong and changes when it finds the truth. We are told to prove all things, and hold fast to what is true (1Ths. 5:21). Our process of growth and understanding was not meant to stop when a leader died. Therefore, we are convinced that if Mr. Armstrong would have lived to this day, he would have changed on this doctrine. Eternal Church of God: The Sabbath Test
    No he would not have!  To say so is a lie!  Cooks, housekeepers, chauffeurs, secretaries, Auditorium stage crew, support staff on church jets, and those that travelled with him all did work on Saturdays, bought things whenever the boss said to and were paid.  Even his Doctor was paid to visit him on Saturdays! The Ambassador Auditorium was allowed to be built on Saturdays as were many other campus buildings.  Feast sites were also built on Saturdays.

    Certain COG leaders have this same issue because they can't get past the physical etched stone 10 commandments.  Their entire emphasis is placed upon the law and obedience while they ignore everything about Jesus and the new covenant. Legalism puffs them up so they can feel superior to everyone else.  They are God's called out.  The Chosen.  Kings and Priests. Afterall, THEY have the "truth." Legalists are always looking at the outward visible signs of obedience.  It is important to be seen doing "right" so they can click their tongues at those stopping off at the DQ for some ice cream.

    All of the Malm's, Thiel's, Meredith's, Pack's, Flurry's and others out there infecting COGland  with their needless rules and regulations need to do us all a favor and follow Paul's exhortation to emasculate themselves.  Maybe then they would shut up and stop lying.

    Grumpy Legalists

    Why Jesus Hates Legalism (Luke 11:37-54)

    The Naked Gospel: The truth you may never hear in church 

    The Sabbath in Crisis

    Twisted Scriptures: Breaking free from churches that abuse


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    A reader here made the following observation about church members who sit back and let the ministry abuse them.  These people have the need to be told what to do and have no idea how to step out and make a decision on their own.  They remain fearful of the ministry over them.  They have seen what happens to rebels who take a stand.  Its never been pretty sight to behold.

    People still look to fools like Malm, Thiel, Pack, Flurry and Meredith to give them the answers.  The world is a safer place when a person is told what to believe than it is to dwell in the questions.

    Pack,Flurry, etc have blown their minds with power and self involvement. 
    I think anyone in that organisation knows it but is afraid. 
    The C of G is filled with people who are not self starters. By and large the membership is teeming with people who need to be told what to do and when to do it.  
    It is a cult and attracts cult minded people and rebels who are rebelling against their family and friends and society. 
    Procrastination is the church motto. People quit and take jobs because ministry tell them to. 
    They marry and divorce as the ministry tell them to. 
    Those who won't go along with the micro control (the rebels) have 'bad attitudes' because they think for themselves. 
    I often wondered if HWA thought that people were gaining experience for the kingdom by being automatons. 
    These groups think they can buy salvation with deeds. The good works don't come from the heart but from the desire for salvation and saving their own skin. 
    This is the difference in a Christian whose heart has the law written in it and the members of the WWCG who read it off a stone tablet.

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    A few days ago I reported that United Church of God failed to draw in significant numbers of people to their public campaigns.   Now it looks like Gerald Weston's leadership has taken its first hit as his reign starts.

    Living Church of God recently ran their own series of public appearance campaigns in order to recruit new income sources.  Just like UCG, they failed rather spectacularly!

    Church of God News has this up:

    Viktor Kubik of UCG was disappointed that a total of only 76 visitors attended the 3 Beyond Today presentations in North Carolina, but LCGs recent attendances have been worse. A Tomorrows World presentation on Sept. 24 in Ohio drew only 13 guests, and only 13 visitors attended 3 Public Bible Studies in Illinois and Missouri.
    Imagine how pathetic it is to only be able to draw in 26 people from three states!  That is 26 out of 31 million people!!!!!!!  26!  Thats no witness at all.  Of those 26 it can almost be guaranteed that 0-1 of them will ever return to attend a church service much less become an income stream.

    This is the entire comment on the LCG site.  It also confirms what most of us  have always suspected. LCG, like UCG, pads their audiences with members tome it look full.
    The Springfield, Illinois, and St. Louis, Columbia and Rolla, Missouri, congregations each recently hosted their first in a series of Bible Study lectures. One of these was held on a Sabbath afternoon and the others were held in late afternoons or early evenings. The topic at each was Armageddon and Beyond. The 13 guests and 90 brethren who attended these lectures saw PowerPoint presentations illustrating end-time prophetic milestones and had a handout to enable them to better follow along. All listened attentively and many took notes. After the presentation, each guest received the booklet Armageddon and Beyond, written by Mr. Richard Ames, and many of them stayed to fellowship with the brethren, who are enthusiastic about hosting more Bible Study lectures beginning in December.—Richard Franz

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    An anonymous source sent me the following excerpts from a sermon of Dave Pack's. The more Dave speaks the further he sinks into mental health issues that are warping his mind with delusional thoughts that could potentially end in a dangerous situation. While he tries to present himself above reproach in the sermon he preaches by presenting himself as an apostle, his words have the potential to set off mentally ill members of his church into bringing his words into reality.

    Dave's believes his god is getting ready to destroy the headquarters of the various splinter groups with a strong wind.

    This sermon is very anti-Semitic and he talks a lot about his god burning the Jewish rabbi's and teachers around the world because they are  deniers of his god.

    Some of what I picked up in the first 45 ,minutes of a 2 hour sermon are this:

    Zech 11  Grace (Beauty) and Bands  nations of the west are about top throw Judah under the bus
    Fire is about to devour people…ministers    Vs 2   all these trees will be brought down…the whole chapter is about god dealing with BAD ministers.
    Vs 7   after ministers are slaughtered, Dave’s god is going to bring the flock (members of splinter groups) over to PC.
    Dave hopes it will be this coming spring  as they gather together in “one accord” by Pentecost
    Lots of reasons to watch the Bands (the brotherhood)   God will cut off three shepherds in one month.  God loathes them as they do him.  God binds the rest into bundles to be burned  Matt 13:30 in a furnace of fire
    When god begins to work with the Jews in Jerusalem, scorners will be burnt to death by god.

    I’m not a fire and bringstone preacher, breathren. But Christ talked over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over about how if you don't obey me am going to burn you.
    Many church members do not believe that.  Dave says he say many ministers and members left in the 70’s because they believed in “universal salvation”   Dave says this makes an absolute mockery of he Bible.   He says if you feel this way then go be an atheist and don't worry about.   Go be Adolph Hitler, or Mother Teresa or whoever you want as it does not make a bit of difference. You will be saved anyway.
    People just don’t believe that his god is going to burn people to death.


    Church has always believed lake of fire was the second death. Christ is going to burn people to death.  To say otherwise is to call him a liar.


    Can no more have the wicked in the first dominion than you can have the devil and his angels in it. Could not get anything done.  Cant even get anything done in the church if people can divide and disagree and blow things off.   Cant get any where if these people are in the church.  What are you to do with them?   They have to be removed.
    For a long time I struggled to determine which was a literal fire and that which was symbolic 
    God is going to burn them in a furnace.  Their ashes will be under OUR feet, otherwise God is a lair!


    I have come clearly to understand that the tares are taken out of the church, bundled, put under the foolish shepherd, wait a while as they wait for Christ’s kingdom to come.  They will be punished alter after Christ comes.  Leaders of the world will be put in chains and imprisoned.  You (RCG members) may be literally the ones who put them in prison and then lets them out.

    God will kill the three Shepard’s.  I saw that in 2012 and I have never moved from that.

    Two great awesome truths have been shown to us over the last three years. One is the unifying of the church to do this awesome, great marvelous work.  A resurrection of the dead is involved.  A worldwide earthquake is involved. Mass healing is involved.  Absolute unity.  400 groups will GO AWAY!  The whole world will see this.  They will come to us in two groups.  Some people will have to choose.  Hopefully they will choose the right one during this fire.  Then the foolish shepherd is destroyed and there is a cursing.  This Work starts with an ENORMOUS BANG! But it’s no the KOG yet. Because there is no way to bring the Kingdom till Christ fixes the rotten, Sodom like rulers of Judah who have been poisoning people since they killed Christ and the prophets before him and the apostles after him.
    The same scorners are in Jerusalem today. Messianic Zionists, who if you get in the way of OUR temple and our country because we are God’s chosen people….they will slit your throat as fast as they will a Palestinians.

    Those leaders have fanned out to synagogues all over the world. The entire world is going to watch God deal with these people (Jews) because they are  in every nation of the world. It's the rabbi’s that are the problem.  It's the religious leaders who hated Christ…the scribes, the Pharisees, the elders and the chief priests.   They are despisers and scorners.  They gotta die!  We are going to have to talk to them to give them a chance to change.  I am going to be going into Jerusalem, but I am going to be going into a lot of other western capitals and saying some fairly serious things, with two guys on either side of me. All of those things are EXACTLY as we believe them.  Its been a long time with prophecy to get to this point were I can explain it to 
    Some more highlights are these points sent by the anonymous source.

    ·         I hope it is this spring…
    ·         Burnt to death by God
    ·         I am not a fire and brimstone preacher
    ·         Christ said over and over and over and over again that if you don’t obey me I am going to burn you. Fire. Ashes. Consume. Take your pick. But I am going to burn you to death.
    ·         You have always believed the lake of fire is the second death
    ·         Christ said over and over and over he is going to burn people to death he means it. It’s serious. And if you say otherwise, you are calling him a liar
    ·         You won’t get anywhere with the church if you don’t remove people 
    ·         Which of these verse are literal and which ones aren’t?
    ·         Tares and wicked are burned to death
    ·         What’s coming on the church is serious. 
    ·         They wait a while, and then they are burnt to death
    ·         The devil knows what he is doing. The devil burnt Jews
    ·         It is interesting how the devil perverts things
    ·         Nobody doubts what this means
    ·         In this case, they are probably going to be cast in alive. 
    ·         Burnt them all to death
    ·         Speculation: Is it possible that God is going to use wind to destroy the splinters headquarters? With literal wind. This is a question, not a statement. 
    ·         We will be swimming in money
    1:32 – Key part
    ·         Put down your Bibles and just listen
    ·         Scriptures listed proving people will be cast alive into a fire
    ·         1:37 – they will be told they are out, and they know they will be burned later
    ·         “If you don’t believe all these plain verses you cannot claim to be obeying the many other less obviously verses in your bible that define Christianity.”
    ·         11 people have left. They have rejected this prophecy. They don’t believe the Bible.
    ·         These verses plain…are impossible to miss. 
    ·         “It impossible to miss them. It’s impossible to miss that those who reject them will be burnt to death this side, long before, the great tribulation and long before the third resurrection.”
    ·         Some will be put to death in the first dominion
    ·         “If you reject all these passages about either death by fire or all of this prophecy you are calling God and Christ liars and you will be burned in a literal oven. All over the world hear God’s servant now. I am telling you. This is serious. The Bible is a real book….
    ·         “Those who are going to be burned it will be long before the tribulation and they won’t even live to see the First Dominion. It will happen at the beginning. Brethren, obey God. Carry out your word to Him. Carry out his will. Pray, study, fast, grow and overcome, so none of these verses need ever apply.”

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    As usual the leadership of the Living Church of God is blaming members for the drop in attendance (i.e income) during Holy Days that fall on week days.  It seems that the church has been unable to get its message clearly across to the Laodicean members in it's midst.   Weston blames it on so many of them being new to the faith.   They apparently are too dumb to understand the reasons why they should be attending instead of going to work or to school.

    Even worse though is the fact that many "old time" members are doing the same thing! Heathens!  James Malm will NOT be happy! Where is the ZEAL????????

    Could it be that they are all sick of being yelled at?  Could it be that they are sick of every single sermon that Meredith preaches has to denigrate gays, women and other Christians?  Could it be they are sick of the endless drivel about jackbooted Germans and rampaging Muslims in every single sermon, article, tv show and tweet?

    The ministry of the Living Church of God has spent decades trying to scare people into believing their baloney.  Fear no longer seems to have a stranglehold on members as it did in years gone by.

    ...I have noticed a different trend over a number of years that when a Holy Day falls during the week, we consistently have a lower attendance than when one falls on the weekend.  This pattern is likely related to newer people who haven’t yet come to understand the importance of God’s annual Sabbaths, but some members have been around long enough to know better.  Paul tells us in Hebrews 11:6 that it is impossible to please God without faith. Let’s all step out in faith this Monday for the Feast of Trumpets and October 12 for the Day of Atonement.—GEW

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    Living Church of God just cannot seem to keep trouble away from its doorstep.   Apparently LCG members are receiving emails and contacts on Facebook for donations and some gullible church members are sending these people money.  A lot of it is coming from Africa and other poor countries.  They see dumb white Americans as a money source, much like what is happening to Almost Arrested Elisha Amos Elijah Joshua Thiel. He is a money stream for people who will jump on to other groups when the money stops.

    LCG needs to prevent this as it cuts into their money stream.

    Requests for Money via E-mail and Social Media—Must Read From time to time, brethren are contacted via e-mail or social media (including Facebook) by individuals claiming to be part of the Church, often overseas, asking for financial help. If you receive such a request, please exercise extreme caution, as most such messages are scams sent by people trying to get money under false pretenses. You would be wise not to send money based on e-mail or social media contact. And remember, the person contacting you may be impersonating someone you know. Please respond by referring any such contact to that person’s local Living Church of God pastor (or Headquarters if you don’t know who their pastor is).  If there is a genuine need, their pastor will be in a better position to address it.

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    Everything felon Ron Weinland has said over the last decade has been a complete lie.  Along with his money grubbing mentally ill second witness wife and his money grubbing laundering son and daughter, he is right now trotting around  Europe on the dime of his few remaining members.

    Sadly Weinland is not unique to the sick men that the Church of God has produced over the last 80 some years.  Look at Gerald Flurry, Dave Pack, Bob Thiel, James Malm, Rod Meredith and all the other lying men leading COG's around the world.  They have all self-appointed themselves as arbitrators of Godly wisdom, of which they are all bankrupt in.

    There is always the possibility that I am wrong.  That is reality.  I don’ believe it for a moment! (snicker) But, I’m not haughty and arrogant enough to believe that I am without capability of being wrong and deceived. And I have been and will continue to act upon what I believe to be true and not upon the “if’s” and possibilities of being wrong.  How can one function that way?
    You know, one of things as well, what if Ron Weinland and what he says does not come to pass in April and what if these things don’t happen in 2008?  There is really a simple answer. I’m a false prophet.  I get tons of email.  I get email every day from people saying, “Well I guess in 2009, a lot of sarcasm comes out, I guess you will be saying this and saying that trying to explain to people.  No I’m done!  I will end being a minister.  I will end being a prophet.
    We have one more Passover.  Possibly two more Feasts.  Depends on a period of six months to one year here and everything is going to come unloosed on this world.  Do you understand how close we are?

    That’s why I’ve tried to say some things and in one respect it should be a little shocking to us. Like I said last Sabbath. I’ll not be your pastor in a little over two years from now. Because you won’t have ANY PASTOR!  (shouting) to lead, guide and direct you to teach you Sabbath by Sabbath, holy day to holy days.  Like I said from 2008, I’m not planning on hosting a Feast of Tabernacles.  I’m not going to rent a building.  I’m not going to sign a contract.

    How’s that honor God? How does that please God and what kind of patience has he shown us. To know you only have two years left or less. Still come before God in Sabbath services

    Its not a real comfortable spot to be in. Just to be real candid with all of you. To set everything on the line and say I will not be your pastor.  There will be about a two-year period after the book is published, after it’s out there. You won’t have any pastors. You won’t have the ability to do the things you are doing today.


    You don't know where you are going to be because you are not going to have any control over it.  We are not going to have the freedom to get out there in the car and go where ewe want in that last 3 ½ years. You know just have the freedom of movement where you would like to be.  You will have people to report to.  They will be over you. Europe will be over us as far the nation is concerned here.  They are the ones to do the conquering, to set up and take control fi you will of government and any movement that happens. We will be here for their bidding and pleasing with whatever they want us to do.

    We understand we are fast approaching a period of time, a 3 ½ year period where we will not be able to meet like this in a fine hotel and fellowship, having food and in halls like this and come together as God’s people to worship our God.


    If you really believe that in a year and half from now this country is not going to be this country.
    Like I said I feel sorry for young people because I can’t imagine having these kind of stresses upon you being told that there is basically a year left of perpetration for you, a year and half maximum and all you know what is gonna break loose, so to speak out here.  Maximum one year and half, that you have in your life.  That means you don’t have to worry about going to to college after that.  You don't have to worry about your job after that.  There’s a lot of things you wont have to worry about, but you will have other worries.  You can’t plan ahead anymore.

    When I make a statement that there will be no president taking office in 2009, because that’s when they take office in January 2009, you know they can go in and maybe start some elections, we are already starting some now, oh you think that's a fun thing. Starting earlier and earlier all the time. People declaring presidency, you know. And I think No you are not going to take office!  I have to do that.
    Please understand having special things happen to you, visions, dreams, other things of other natures, it did not come from God!  Use wisely the remaining time you have to seek God because when the 3 ½ years of final tribulation begins those freedoms will come to an end till the day Jesus Christ has returned.

    Can you imagine when you are being preached to, when you are being spoken to by the God family Elohim, because that’s the next Feast of Tabernacles when Jesus Christ returns.  All of this earth
    I know there has been some anxiousness, a little bit of anxiety on some people’s parts, when all the sudden, oh you know we have some more time and we could have had a Feast of tabernacles.  Well that as decided last Feast of tabernacles we would not have a normal feast of tabernacles.  There will be a Fest of Tabernacles every year from here on out.

    There is coming the end time tribulation of massive destruction and war.  These things begin next year and are finished by the fall of 2011. 
    There is coming a time here when you will not have the freedom to go and search the internet, you wont have the freedom to go and listen to sermons online, you are not going to have the freedoms and opportunities that you have right now.  Yu only have a few months left to do these things.

    If by Pentecost that it is not powerfully clear and abundantly clear that there has been a great deal of destruction that will encompass a 1/3 of all plant life in the US and at least the clear results of this mingled with blood, the death of very much animal life and the beginning of death of human life, I WILL STIOP PREACHING!  Just so all the critics and everyone else out there will under stand, I AM TRUE TO MY WORD in these things.  If for all the critics, if by the end of July, and most likely by Pentecost, if nothing has caused death I will make it very clear I am a false prophet.  When we are told a third of all plant life will be destroyed, that is exactly what it means.
    Is this really going to happen?  Is he really a prophet of God?  Is he really the end time witness?  YES, I AM! (shouting)

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    Rod Meredith and others love to proclaim they have a forceful message that is important to get out to the world.  They claim to be a bold witness for truth's lost to the world.  They and only they have the true words of God to call to task the evil world they live in.

    From Rod Merdith warning about your gay neighbors, unisex bathrooms and rampaging Chinese/German/Muslim hoards,  to Jimmy Meredith preaching at the annual Christmas party, these great messages can no longer be heard online without giving LCG your name and getting a password so you can listen.

    Gerald Weston has laid down more laws as he rises in power.  He and only he was will approve which messages the unwashed masses can listen to online.

    Live broadcasts are no longer open for anyone to view.  
    David Goods service for COGWA - which allows non-members to request a password to view live Sabbath and holy day services - has been discontinued by LCG. Only recorded sermons that have been authorized by Gerald Weston will now available.  
    Roderick Meredith will of course decide if the livestrem service on Christmas Eve during the Family Weekend festival is to be open to everyone, as it was last year.  COG News
    Any church that claims to be presenting a witness to the world does NOT hide their sermons and articles behind password protects. LCG needs to do this because Rod Meredith, Gerald Weston, Richard Ames and others says stupid things.

    It has nothing to do with the "milk and meat" nonsense that the church has always used. Babes to the "truth" don't need milk sermons anymore than regular members need "meat" sermons. 

    If prospective members actually knew what LCG preached they would run the other direction. After publicly being shamed by Meredith's sermon contributing to the Milwaukee murders, LCG knows it can't afford to the have sermons freely up online for the public to listen to.  

    Boasting that your message is BOLD and a WITNESS TO THE WORLD is a lie when you hide behind firewalls. The gospel is free to anyone who wants to listen and cannot be thwarted by embarrassed men hiding behind passwords to protect their uninspiring, legalistic, and graceless messages. 

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    Who Will Bob Thiel Divine Blame for Hurricane Matthew?

    The Pope
    Miami Dolphins
    All the Other Continuing Churches of God
    The Laodiceans


    You Decide

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    The latest issue of The Journal is out and there is an article by Lonnie Hendricks (an occasional contributor here) concerning Ian Boyne venturing into the lions den of this blog and Ambassador Watch.

    The post that Ian contributed to was this one: LCG Preaches The Godly Love Is The Most Important Quality the evolved into a discussion of the policy of the COG when it comes to disfellowshipping members, Ian had this to say:

    The response of Anonymous 12:23 is a perfect example of my thesis that the elephant in the room is the Bible---at least if one is applying a conservative hermeneutic to it. The Bible clearly gives the ministry the right to excommunicate for doctrinal reasons.Does Anonymous disagree with that? Even liberal scholars would admit that ,while saying one might choose to ignore those passages in favor of a higher principle To say that Winnail was unloving simply he applied a tool which we all knew upon becoming members was a part of the church's toolbox is, respectfully, nonsense. All organizations have rules of association and dissociation.I don't know the particular case It might well have been an abusive disfellowshipment But to suggest the act itself is contrary to Doug Winnail's pronouncement of love is a non-sequitur.

    I personally as a minister choose not to disfellowship for doctrinal disagreement I consider most of the doctrinal disagreements my congregants have to be inconsequential and even those which might be significant I don't disfellowship for because I have the pulpit to counter them I don't doubt my ability to do so. In my congregation I have a group of fellows who routinely on the sabbath discuss all kinds of doctrinal ideas and freely disagree with what is taught from the pulpit They pose no threat and they are going nowhere for they can find no better alternative and fully see the bankruptcy of orthodox Christianity. This another Jesus, another Gospel that Anonymous refers to seems to be coming from that foolish, reactionary view that any emphasis on Christ is Protestantism through the back door. The same obscurantist nonsense that caused Charles Bryce to leave Living. Some of the fanatics will leave Living to go elsewhere because of the small reforms taking place there which Chief Pharisee Malm deplores.But the ministry has the right to withdraw the hand of fellowship Look at the harsh, strident words Paul had for those teaching a different doctrine. While Armstrongism continues to accept the Bible as its rule book, you can continue to expect disfellowshipment In my view it ,is used far too frequently and carelessly and often is a mask for the theological incompetence of ministers Here in Jamaica I offer a platform for those who disagree and I use the pulpit to proclaim the tenets of Armstrongism so that the membership is firmly grounded in Biblical truth Yes, in my view Armstrongism represents Biblical truth I hold that provisionally and tentatively ,fully aware that I could well be proven wrong. I keep reading widely so if I am wrong,I will, hopefully, find out and then renounce Armstrongism. If there is any book anyone wants to recommend or any scholarly material which might prove useful in opening my eyes ,please recommend it And yes I have already read all the scandal-revealing books like Tangled Web, as well as those by Marion McNair, John Tuit, William Hinson --every single one written by every ex-member And ,yes ,every issue of Ambassador Report .Give me some intellectual arguments now.

    But, please ,let's not talk foolishness about disfellowshipment automatically and necessarily indicating a lack of love Ian Boyne

    Because I want people to freely comment, I rarely contribute to the conversations. I feel the people should have the ability to express what they need to say, though I will delete an occasional post from obviously nasty people.  What this has allowed is scores of LCG members and other COG members to find a place here that they can comment and express their frustration at the current state of affairs of their respective churches.

    Ian and I did however have several email exchanges which were rather pleasant. I think he was surprised that I was not an atheist with a chip on my shoulder.  I also told him that if we ever sat down to talk about things that we would probably have more in common than he imagined.
    It is quit obvious though that he and I both do not agree on some things.

    I find his take on "reimagining Armstrongism" interesting, though I see no way imaginable that it could survive in the long run.  There are too many bodies scattered along the road over the last 80 some years to make preserving Armstrongism as a viable belief system.

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  • 10/08/16--07:37: Spiders and Snakes

  • Narcissism and the Rise of Split/Splinter and Sliver Apostles

    Until I was about 45, I never knew what a narcissist was , or at least had only vague ideas of what the mental state of one given to such actually meant.  In hind sight , and in my own WCG experience, I was surrounded by them and it should be obvious now after all these years of the rising Apostles, Prophets and Wanna Be's , the Worldwide Church of God, was infested with them waiting for the right time to rise to their perceptions of ministry and power.  I do recall a few times listening to the sermons or ideas of or having to react to members rage at what their local minister was doing to the local church or to them personally, and wondering whatever happened to "Let him who is greatest among you be your servant."?   I understand Ron Dart also noticed that and said as far as he was concerned that was the only scripture about Church Government that mattered. Yet it certainly has escaped the split/splinter and sliver types beyond comprehension.

    We have all here on Banned heard the term and seen it defined but let's remind ourselves:

    A 2012 book on power-hungry narcissists suggests that narcissists typically display most, and sometimes all, of the following traits:[7]

    It is not just a male Apostle issue

    Why those who still follow those who have risen to the top of the ash heap of the WCG , with all of their obvious inflated views of themselves , to the point of seeing themselves spoken of in the scriptures , remain blind to this psychological state of mind in their leaders is beyond me.  It seems the mind grows numb when the more outlandish and ridiculous the claims of the leader are repeated weekly from their bully pulpits.

    They ARE wrong, wrong, wrong in their bold pronouncements , over and over and over again, and still the sheep are stuck in the pen hanging on every word.  It goes against the natural reaction of humans to quickly release or brush off a spider or a snake. Why not in these cases?  Is the message so strong and so threatening as to what will happen to YOU if you don't believe ME, the member goes brain dead and cannot think critically about what they are being told?  Are they afraid they will "not make it into the Kingdom"? or get fried like the errant Jews and non-RCG types?

    How many times can one be bullied into selling homes, sending in retirement monies or giving property and resources to these wolves in wolves clothing?  Why do they quickly believe it when a man says, "And yes Brethren, I am an Apostle" as if just declaring it makes it so.  Not to mention getting "double portioned" under dubious circumstances.  And the many many more blatantly stupid and false statements these offshoot Apostles make that we are all very familiar with here at Banned.

    If you are a lurking follower of Mr. David C Every Title in the Bible is ME, Gerald Just Leave Your Families Behind and Follow ME, Ron I Will Get It Right Someday, Bob We and ME at the Continuing Church of God , Rod I'm Not Kidding Fellows and Girls or any other human being who feels compelled to tell you how all of life, history and the Bible points to them, take a good read of the common and well known traits of the narcissists among us and those given to religious delusions about themselves and think it over long and hard.  Your own future mental health and that of your family and children are definitely at stake. 

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    ...why do false teachers have such a love for strings of titles? 
    After all, there are worldly religious figures I respect more than you, 
    who themselves are doctors, but they do not obscure it 
    with a long list of irrelevant and superfluous other degrees, studies and titles.

    Several people have recently sent me emails concerning Almost Arrested, Doubly Blessed, Elisha, Elijah, Amos, Joshua, Chief Overseer, Apostle, Prophet, Mayan Authority and End Time Witness Bob Thiel and his constantly changing story about his "theological" education and the Ph.D  and Th.D he attaches to his name to legitimize his prophet status in the eyes of his deceived followers in Africa and gullible media personalities that include him on there radio broadcasts.

    As one reader here points out, the self-appointed false prophet got his Ph.D from a diploma mill in Cincinnati called Union Institute and University.  It does not take much searching online to find out that UIU has some serious issue with their diploma's, particuarly with the Ph.D's it issued at the time the self-appointed false prophet claims he was earning his.

    The false prophet has this posted on his "Who is COGwriter?"
    I have studied graduate level Early Church History from Fuller Theological Seminary and other schools in and out of the USA, and after a lot of writing, was granted a foreign Th.D. in early Christianity. A doctor of philosophy (Ph.D.) degree was earned from the Union Institute and University (1993) where I studied various biological sciences and research methodologies. I also have other degrees/training, and have studied theology, both formally and informally.
    By lumping a few classes at Fuller Seminary close to his "Th.D" it gives the impression his "theology" Th.D degree is from Fuller.

    Compare this to the story Ambassador Watch posted in April of 2016 after Thiel said he had a Th.D from TCU, which if you are from the U.S. means Texas Christian University.  One of AW's readers contacted TCU and this is what transpired: the endeavor to "prove all things" I called the Registrar's Office (817-257-7825) of Texas Christian University located in Ft. Worth, Texas – and talked to one Kristi Harrison at the Registrar’s Office. She informed me of the following facts: First of all, Texas Christian University does NOT have a doctorate of theology (ThD) program. They do have a Masters of Theological Studies program, a Master of Divinity program, and a Master of Theology program – but not a ThD program. And second, the name of Bob (or Robert) Thiel does NOT show up on ANY student listing the university has. They have a computerized file dating from 1984 forward – and Thiel is NOT on this one. And they have a microfiche file for students who attended before 1984 – and Thiel doesn’t show up on this one either.
    Thiel, then changed his web site to state this:
    ...I have studied graduate level Early Church History from Fuller Theological Seminary and other schools in and out of the USA like T of CU, where a Th.D. in Early Christianity was earned). A doctor of philosophy (Ph.D.) degree was earned from the Union Institute and University where I studied various biological sciences and research methodologies. I also have other degrees/training, and have studied theology, both formally and informally.
    It was then discovered that Thiel got his diploma from another diploma mill in India, even though it is essentially attached to a fundamentalist Calvinist belief system:
    Bob may have acquired a mail order degree from Trinity School of Apologetics & Theology in Kochi.
    Following up on an anonymous tip in the previous comments section, a web search revealed that Trinity is a fundamentalist institution in India which has a Calvinist orientation, and offers "Free Apologetics/Theology Graduate Distance Programs." It's listed in places like Conservapedia and Creationwiki, and is sited next to Cochin University, but from what I can tell is definitely not part of that institution (although to read the Trinity website you might assume it was!) T of CU would then mean Trinity of Cochin University, which seems to be a clear misrepresentation.
    Not only did Ambassador Watch take on Thiel's bogus degrees, but a Living Church of God member, who knows more about Thiel's shenanigans than most, also laid into Thiel's lies.
    Take his “doctor” title. Doctor of what? If I came to you and said I was a doctor and gave medical advice, wouldn’t you assume by my actions I was a doctor of medicine? Likewise, if I went around putting “Dr” on my books, and the books were on religion, would you not assume my doctorate was in theology? And, if those things turned out not to be true, wouldn’t you believe I was a fraud? And, rightly so! 
    Buried deep within his website is the admission that “I have studied graduate level Early Church History from Fuller Theological Seminary and other schools in and out of the USA, and after a lot of writing, was granted a foreign Th.D. in early Christianity. A doctor of philosophy (Ph.D.) degree was earned from the Union Institute and University (1993) where I studied various biological sciences and research methodologies.” 
    Not that it matters, which makes it even more curious that he would use such a means to elevate himself. However, his pride in his research is obviously flawed...
    Which makes you wonder why anyone would follow such a person who claims to hold the truth dear when they obviously do not. Thiel twists COG current events and the Bible in a similarly deceitful manner.
    A quick check of the internet pulls all kinds of stuff up on the Union Institute  and University.  One of the more telling things is how UIU lost their ability to issue Ph.D just a couple years after Thiel claims he got his.  This means his "degree" was "earned" without the expectations that normal doctorate students have to follow.  Plus, being a self study program basically let Thiel do whatever the wanted to claim his expertise in.
    The Union Institute's Ph.D. program came under scrutiny by the Ohio Board of Regents in the late 1990s, early 2000s which culminated in its 2002 Reauthorization Report. The report was critical of the Union Institute's Ph.D. program, noting in particular that " ... expectations for student scholarship at the doctoral level were not as rigorous as is common for doctoral work ... " (OBR 2002 Reauthorization Report, page 13) As a result, The Union was put on probation, the Union Graduate School was dissolved and the Ph.D. program was restructured.  The Gist
    Thiel has this to say on his Doctors's Research site where he peddles herbs and vitamins:
    The research group at Doctors' Research is directed by Robert Thiel, who holds a Ph.D. in nutrition science. He is licensed as a naturopath by the State of North Carolina, registered as a naturopath by the District of Columbia, and is licensed as a naturopathic physician within Idaho. He maintains a natural health clinic in Arroyo Grande, California.
    His UIU PH.D that was "earned" under less than desirable doctoral research.

    Thiel uses this Ph.D and his questionable Th.D every chance he gets.  The gullible Africans might fall for it, but COG members do not.

    Thiel also claims he has other qualifications:

    Dr. Bob Thiel holds a Master's degree from the University of Southern California and a Ph.D. from the Union Institute and University. His writings have made him a sought-after expert in the fields of philosophy, religion, research, science, and prophecy. In the past twelve years, he has published scores of articles on these topics in a variety of respected print publications. Dr. Thiel has also received several awards for his research.

    Dr Thiel is a Christian who relies on Bible prophecies. He has been married to his wife Joyce since 1981. They travel extensively to ancient and prophetic sites throughout the world, including Mayan sites, Asia Minor, Greece, Asia, Africa, Fatima (Portugal), the Vatican, and Washington D.C. Armageddon Books
    Thiel uses his travels as if he is the authority upon all the areas he goes to.  Just because he has been to Cappadocia, Turkey, Israel, the Vatican and scores of other places does not make him an authority these places.

    I have been to England many times have have had private tours of Westminster Abbey and personal conversations with historians and vergers working there. I have an extensive library filled  antique and modern books on UK and Anglican history, but that no more makes me an authority on Westminster Abbey, the UK or Anglicanism, than Thiel is an authority the Cappidocians, Ephesus, Asia Minor.

    I know what he is doing though.  He is following in the myth that Herbert Armstrong used as his excuse for not getting a theological or college education.  He earned his degree in the School of Hard Knocks.  Even Thiel's spiritual Daddy, Rod Meredith has used that phrase for decades.

    The Church of God Perspective site asked Thiel the following:

    You yourself stated that your PhD was not in Theology. If that has changed, then so be it.  However, I know it will go above your head the fact that this makes you an even smaller man that even I could have imagined. Please, tell us, Dr Thiel, why do false teachers have such a love for strings of titles? After all, there are worldly religious figures I respect more than you, who themselves are doctors, but they do not obscure it with a long list of irrelevant and superfluous other degrees, studies and titles.
    Title's and studies have been very important to certain COG leaders over the decades.  Every single one of them ended up being liars and false prophets.  

    For more see:

    Bob Thiel and his remarkable PhD

    Bob Thiel: Is Still a Liar and False Prophet 

    COGWriter Bob Thiel is a seriously delusional character.

    Thiel's personal sites:

    Nazarene Books

    Doctors' Research

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    It has not been a pretty sight in Wadsworth these past few months.  Dave Pack's self imagined and designed personality cult has been rocked by countless ministers resigning.  It has been such a debacle that almost every couple of weeks another minister turns in his resignation.

    This has been a serious blow to the prideful Pack who was looking to these ministers to help with the tens of thousands of COG members who are supposed to be soon flocking to the Restored Church of God after Dave's god sends a strong wind to blow down the HQ's of UCG, PCG, LCG, COGWA and others.  These ministers were supposed to help reeducate the wayward Laodiceans into the new truths that have been revealed to Dave, especially concerning the First Dominion and his roll in it.

    This past week Dave suffered a major blow when William Behrer and his wife resigned. This was particularly bitter to Dave's ego considering that the RCG had sent out to all RCG congregations Behrer sermon from one year ago to be played on Feast of Trumpets 2016.  As this was being played, Behrer was walking out the door.

    Behrer was one of Dave's senior ministers in Wadsworth.  Behrer had a reputation for being one of the most loved RCG ministers.  He treated members with fairness and grace, which are qualities seriously lacking in Dave Pack and other RCG henchmen.

    At one point Behrer was one of only three pastor rank ministers.  Now he and another minister have left the church.

    Previously a minister from the Carolina's resigned, as has a minister serving in England.  Canada also has not been immune to RCG resignations. The minister serving the Ontario and upstate New York also resigned.

    Almost all RCG members know nothing about these resignations.  Dave and his crew in Wadsworth have kept it from them.  Most members have not even heard about the several ministers who resigned earlier in the year!

    Even with all of Dave's new sermons being added to his endless series of new revelations, it has not been able to stop the exodus.   After all, this latest sermon was #45 in the series. Yes, you read that right...45! Many of these sermons are 2 hours in length!  Members are leaving in droves, many from sheer boredom!

    Perhaps these men have finally seen through the lies of Dave and his perverted quest for power and dominion.  His pipe dream of being the person to train the two witnesses is imploding around him.

    The dramatic drop in income from ministers and members leaving has thwarted his plans to complete his mini-me Ambassador campus in Wadsworth. The David C Pack Auditorium is a pipe dream right now.  What will the people of Wadsworth do without a concert hall?

    Dave has turned into his own worst nightmare.  Sadly, those remaining members are left terribly unhappy and confused about the slow collapse around them.  How could God be letting the only true church implode, again? It has been one failed prophecy after another.  Three COG leaders have not been struck down.  Their members have not joined the RCG in its final work.

    Even all the headache pills in the Giant Eagle across from the most superfantabulous Church of God HQ in humanity's history can't stem the massive headache Dave is suffering right now.

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    double click to enlarge

    This is a screen shot of the posting on itstimecog earlier this year.  On October 13, 2016 we will see how true this really was.  Did God delay the earthquake because the brethren were not ready?  Did God delay the earthquake to find out who will win the U.S. Presidential Election in November?  Is God giving the church more time?

    We all know that it is not going to happen. Sure there may be earthquakes somewhere on October 11-12 in the U.S. particularly here in California.  We have them every single day.   Totally destroyed?  Not so much.  False prophets? Very much so.

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    No Church of God leader can have a legitimate empire without owning or imitating something that Herbert Armstrong touched or acquired.  You too can start your own cult and live in luxury on the Ambassador Campus, just like HWA did!  Better yet, you can dream dreams in one of the bedrooms and then have someone doubly-bless you in the basement and you will be set to go!

    This grand Italian Revival mansion isn’t just one of the swankiest homes on Millionaire’s Row in Pasadena. It’s also been an integral part of a controversial religious institution. Now a devoted buyer can write his or her own intriguing chapter in one of Southern California’s oldest and most famous communities—for $4.8 million.
    When you hear “Millionaire’s Row,” your mind races to Beverly Hills or Bel Air. However, this seven-figure home is located in an enclave in relatively sleepy Pasadena. If you’ve seen the city’s Rose Parade on New Year’s Day, you might have noticed some of the gorgeous historical mansions along the parade route and wondered, “Who lives in those houses? I bet they have some great stories.”

    The home was a private residence until 1947, when Herbert W. Armstrong, leader of the Worldwide Church of God, came to town and began acquiring the lavish mansions on Millionaire’s Row to anchor his newly founded Ambassador College.
    ulousThe educational institution was established as a liberal arts college, but its main mission was to prepare youth for life and service in the church. The church had a checkered history over the decades and was besieged by controversy and scandal.
    In the ’90s the college was moved to Texas, and the church began selling off small parts of the once-thriving college.
    Many of the buildings sat vacant for more than a decade, but this particular home was used for special events (e.g., it was a staging area for nuptials held in its gardens). Around the turn of the century, developers bought the 19-acre property and turned it into a community known as Ambassador Gardens. The development includes the three historic mansions, an original sunken Italian-style garden and other formal gardens, the Ambassador Auditorium, and a number of luxury townhouses, condos, and private residences.

    Bob Thiel could run his mind boggling end time global empire from the basement and store his secrets behind the hidden room in the basement. 

    Perhaps Gerald Flurry can buy it and move it to Oklahoma.  Better yet, Dave Pack can move it to Wadsworth and not have to worry about building his new home.  Dave can then say he trained at Herbert's feet in this very building!

    See the entire article with pictures here:  Live on Millionaires Row In This Fascinating Italian Revival

    Please, Mr. 

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    Living Church God seems to have one trial after another lately.  It's latest issue is with two of its Feast sites.  One has been cancelled due to the hurricane and the second is scrambling to find another venue in Haiti because of the horrendous damage.

    Gone are the days of COG's boldly proclaiming from their pulpits how God directed a hurricane away from Caribbean, Latin America and Coastal U.S. Feast sites.  Now God just lets the hurricanes slam ashore and mess up hotels and sites fully booked.  Gone are the days of celebrating hurricanes turning around and destroying Cuba and other islands just so COG faithful can have eight days of millennial bliss as they overindulge on food and alcohol while the unwashed "gentiles" suffer God's wrath elsewhere.

    God's protection seems to be slipping away.

    From an LCG source:
    It looks like God has stricken one of the feast sites of the purest, cleanest, holiest, most godly, sole Philadelphian remnant of the one-and-only true church of God. 
    For the 1st time in the history of ACOG splits, a feast site is cancelled all together AFTER hundreds of members have put down their deposits and made their travel plans. 
    Today, LCG announced that they have cancelled their feast site in Hilton Head, SC. 
    According to LCG, God is now (suddenly) "placing His name" in Charlotte. 
    Was LCG's festival planner Lil' Jimmy Meredith not listening to God when he signed the SC contract? Or did God "place His name" there but then suddenly decide to change His mind? It's obvious to many of us that God has nothing to do with LCG but it's hard not to wonder how they will spin this since they believe the are the "one-and-only church of God". 
    LCG has a booklet called, "Who Controls the Weather?" If one follows the reasoning outlined in that booklet, it seems pretty obvious that God is punishing LCG. 
    One thing is for sure, lying Rod Meredith will figure out some way to sell it to his congregants that will have little to do with reality or repentance. 
    Now LCG members get to have the feast in the very same town where 90% of them live and work anyway, Charlotte, NC. How exciting! 
    Lil' Jimmy is working out the details now and will soon let the membership know the name of the place God is placing His name in Charlotte (my guess is it will be where they have their Christmas party every year). Until then, we will all be waiting with baited breath!

    This was posted on

    Dear brethren,
    Hilton Head Location moving to Charlotte...  We continue to pray for the thousands of people who were affected by Hurricane Matthew.  Lives and homes were lost and much damage occurred in Haiti, other islands, and up and down the East Coast of the USA.  There is also flooding and various damage in Hilton Head, which was one of our planned sites for the Feast of Tabernacles this year.  Due to the hurricane, the resort we had planned to use is not available. 
    We are planning on moving the location to Charlotte with Mr. Richard Ames being here the first half and Mr. Gerald Weston will be here the second half.  Several additional ministers will also serve at this site.  We are still trying to nail down the exact venue, but trust that God will provide the right location.
    If you had reservations with the Hilton Head Beach and Tennis Resort, your refund is in progress.  However, it could be 5 to 7 days before it is credited to your account.  If you made plans offsite or through other means such as VRBO or HOMEAWAY, then of course we encourage you to quickly request cancellation due to these unforeseen circumstances. 
    Activity ticket refunds will be issued as soon as possible; however, regrettably you may not receive it before the Feast begins.  Festival Advisors, your immediate attention is requested to help those without internet access. 
    We are working on an orderly plan to quickly re-distribute members to various Feast sites where space is available.  Accordingly, we are asking all those registered to Hilton Head to RE-REGISTER to one of the following sites:

    Panama City, FL
    Osage Beach, MO
    Traverse City, MI
    Mount Snow, VT
    San Diego, CA

    Please re-register at one of the above sites, as soon as possible.
    Again, we all are very disappointed by this most unfortunate reality, and the hurried situation this puts all of us in to make new plans for the Feast.  The Festival Office and Festival Coordinators will do everything we can to make the transition as smooth as possible.  Remember, brethren, God is in charge, and He has promised that “all things work for good to those that love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose” (Romans 8:28). 
    Even through the trial, let’s thank God for His protection and guidance, as we ask Him to provide the way to keep His wonderful Feast of Tabernacles!
    An additional notice was put up by Gerald Weston:

    Greetings from Charlotte,
    This has been a very active week. Many of our ministers in all parts of the world traveled to serve our members for the Feast of Trumpets: Mr. Richard Ames in Missouri, Dr. Douglas Winnail in Tennessee, Mr. Dexter Wakefield in New England, Mr. James Meredith in South Africa, and Carol and I were in Atlanta where we had six ordinations in the three congregations represented there. When we talk about the weather this week, it is not small talk. Hurricane Matthew devastated a number of islands in the Caribbean, including Haiti where the only bridge to our Festival site was knocked out.  Dr. Wilner Pierre is now busy scrambling to find a new site. As far as we know all our brethren are okay in the Caribbean, but it is almost a certainty that many have suffered property damage. By the time you read this, Florida will have been affected by Matthew to a greater or lesser degree and many hundreds of thousands will have had their lives disrupted.  I would like to mention that Mr. Terrence Kennell, an elder in Florida, died this Thursday. Dr. Meredith is planning to attend the Feast of Tabernacles in San Diego. Your prayers for Dr. Meredith and for all our ministers and members who are traveling during this Festival season are greatly appreciated.—GEW  


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    Today is the Church of God version of Yom Kippur, Atonement, one of the most holy days for the Jewish people. Various churches are afflicting their bodies today by abstaining from food and drink.  Some COG groups however have already celebrated Atonement a few weeks ago.  As usual the church cannot agree upon anything.

    Today the most arrogant and legalistic of the official church Pharisees, James Malm, made the following proclamation on behalf of the self-made creature god he follows.
    What does it mean to be “cut off from your people”?  It means that if we do not fast on this day we shall be rejected from being a part of the Covenant people; rejected from being a part of the bride – the Ekklesia of the faithful!
    So there you have it.  Because you took a drink of water, had some orange juice or a bagel this morning you are damned to the lake of fire. There is no chance for you now.

    A comment from a 2013 posted on this blog had this:

    Rather than realizing that the Old Covenant shadows were fulfilled and no longer required to be kept, HWA instilled marketing elements into them to further his own empire and purposes. These marketing elements modified their ancient Jewish significance by injecting Herbert Armstrong's exclusionary Revelation-based understanding of Jesus' nature and personality into them. He also tainted them with his non-Holy Spirit motivated "government from the top down" and British Israelism.
    Probably the Jews and Messianics in temple today are receiving better, more accurate insights into these shadows. In most of the ACOGs, unfortunately, chauvinism is being created and nurtured.

    Relive those fun days by listening to this:


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    For many decades the Church of God has worked overtime to write about the significance of the Azazel goat in association with the Day of Atonement.  United Church of God, COGWA and Living Church of God pay particular attention to the story.

    The church has always associated the Azazel goat with the arch-deacon, Satan.  That "teaching" apparently stems from The Book of Enoch.  Living Church of God teaches a belief from the book, yet they disfellowship people for reading the book.  They use it to support their doctrine yet tell their plebe members that it a heretical book. What a pickle LCG is in!

    Living Church of God fails to see that the Azazel Goat association with demons was the major premise in The Book of Enoch and its fallen angels. The very same book that the LCG went ballistic over after it was discovered that some LCG members were reading and discussing it.

    For more on the story check out:   Just what do you mean...Atonement?

    The United Church of God, another splinter, aptly explains the symbolism Herbert Armstrong attached to the Day of Atonement through the lens of speculative prophecy, for which he was famous. Armstrong claimed that the scapegoat released in the wilderness pictured Satan being be bound and thrown in the bottomless pit, as described in Revelation 20. Removal of the devil would allow man to achieve "at-one-ment" with God, they say.

    "This sending away into the desert is part of the reason for translating Azazel as scapegoat, or goat that escapes. But many scholars identify Azazel as the name of a demon inhabiting the wilderness," UCG explains. "It stands to reason that Azazel is one in stark contrast to the Lord—indeed, the ultimate enemy Satan the devil."
    This explanation sounds good until you examine the context and timing of Leviticus versus the literature that names Azazel as a demon. The primary source scholars use to support the Azazel theory is the Book of Enoch. Scholars believe the Book of Enoch was written between the 300s B.C. and the first century A.D. because it includes late Aramaic names not present until that time period, according to The Expositor's Bible Commentary. It is likely that the Book of Enoch used Leviticus, which is believed to date to the 1440s B.C., as a source. Not vice-versa. The demon of the wilderness likely got its name from lore related to this ancient ritual, according to both Expositor's and the Brown-Driver-Briggs Lexicon. The ritual did not borrow a name from a figure that appears in literature at least a thousand years later.

    Further, the COGs have traditionally rejected non-canonical sources such as the Book of Enoch. In fact, the Living Church of God disfellowshipped members last year for reading and discussing the Book of Enoch. So the Azazel teaching puts the COGs in the precarious position of placing faith in a book that it tells its own members is heretical.

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    God will choose 
    (Bob Thiel says don't vote for either )

    Political leaders are for our good.
    (Bob Thiel says watch out!)

    They only will give you problems if you are a wrongdoer.

    ... Says the Apostle Paul

    How Do We View Romans 13 in the 21st Century?
    ( or ever?)

    Romans 13New International Version (NIV)

                 Submission to Governing Authorities

    13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established.The authorities that exist have been established by God.
    Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. 

    But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer.

    Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.
    This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

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    It has been while since we have heard about Eric King here.  During this absence he has been busy making new prophecies and communicating with his alien overlords.  He suffered the death of his favorite horse recently and was really broken up over that.

    He has released the following two videos which are an even clearer indication on how troubled his mind is.  It is actually kind of sad to see this melt down.  If you could divorce him from all of the Armstrongism and other religious malarky he is in he actually looks like a decent guy with a big heart.

    Just further proof on how damaging the church has been to countless people over the decades.


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