Glenn Washington: NPR's Great Black Hope

August 1, 2017, 7:37 am

≫ Next: Restored Church of God: Dale Schurter Back In The Fold Ready To Minister To Surging RCG Membership

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From The Atlantic:

NPR’s Great Black Hope
The radio network’s stereotypical listener is a 50-something white guy. Can Glynn Washington, the fastest-rising public-radio star in memory, change that?

Glynn Washington is a former COG member who shares stories of his life growing up in Armstrongism.

Many NPR hosts come from NPR-ish families. Not Washington. “I grew up in a cult,” he told me. His parents were members of the Worldwide Church of God, a sect founded by Herbert W. Armstrong, an apocalyptic radio evangelist based in Pasadena. Washington got out—a story he tells with an escapee’s pride—and went on to the University of Michigan and its law school. He studied in Japan, then worked for the State Department, then ended up directing a program at the University of California at Berkeley. Some of the best Snap Judgment segments are drawn from his own life, and you get the feeling he could carry several episodes a year by himself.

Read the full story here.

More stories that appeared here on Banned:

Glynn Washington weaves his childhood in the WCG into his stories on PBS

Losing My Religion

Glynn Washington: Apocalypse

Glynn Washington: The Reunion

Glynn Washington: The Son of Ham

Glynn Washington Snap Judgment: Choosing Sides

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Restored Church of God: Dale Schurter Back In The Fold Ready To Minister To Surging RCG Membership

August 1, 2017, 7:38 am

≫ Next: Restored Church of God Former Staff Member: My Exit Story

≪ Previous: Glenn Washington: NPR's Great Black Hope

From the Church of God News:

Dale Schurter was sidelined 18 months ago, but he has now been restored to the fold. David Pack began part 82 of his latest sermon series by announcing that:

“Mr. Dale Schurter is actively serving in the ministry again; doing much better and that’s wonderful - at the young age of 80, about two weeks ago today ... So he’s serving as the Associate Pastor with Mr. McElroy in Dayton, Ohio.”

Both Dale Schurter and Larry McElroy moved to RCG from the United Church of God.

COGNews continues with this bit from Dave on the almost ready to surge membership of the RCG.

Pack then talked once more about the surge of people who will be wanting to join RCG ... “it should be obvious if you think this through, that it becomes exponential. The people who are excited enough to get others to come and who come, are therefore, going to react, logically, the same way that the excited people who urged them did, and they’re going to go out and do the same thing. And then, that’s going to double and so forth.”

Using the concept of a penny doubling every day and becoming $11 billion after 40 days, he muses ... “here in Ezekiel 33 we’re talking about people. So if one tells two and then two tell four and four tell eight ... it would be on about Day 36 when you get to almost 700 million ... and then if you went four more days, you would go way beyond the total population of Earth.

Dave is anticipating 2,000 members to soon join up with his group, but more importantly, he has his eyes on their money!

Now obviously, God has to bless that process...” Is that where his analogy fails?
Two weeks previously, in part 80, he exclaimed ... “we’re starting to take off again. You can imagine with our budget. And staggering numbers. I would anticipate within 2, 3, 4 months at the most, over 2,000 households are going to ask to come to church. An awful lot of them are going to stay 12 weeks, or they don’t come at all, the vast majority. Low, single digits will be the only ones that come, and then how many even stay?”

“Staggering numbers” ask to come to church, but hardly any come, and fewer stay, even for a short time.

Of course, those newcomers are in for a rude shock. Dave has set up strict incorporation guidelines for any potential members. A loyal RCG minion MUST first visit with them in their homes. Then, if approved, they will be forced to go through the same "eye washing" that Dale Schurter went through.

Before being allowed to come to church, each household must be visited by an RCG minister, and that seems to be enough to put most people off attending.

The Dale Schurter Propaganda/Resignation Letter

Dave Pack Drags Dale Schurter Out of the Reeducation Camp to Introduce the Most IMPORTANT Agricultural Program On Earth

Dale Schurter: The Master of Flip Flopping (Updated)

Dave Pack Discards Dale Schurter and Publicly Shames Him and His Wife

Dale Schurter and David C Pack: The Love Story That Wasn't

Where In The World Is Dale Schurter? Can You Find Him?

Where's Dale Schurter?

Dale Schurter Resurfaces Claiming He Is Suffering "Intense Persecution"

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Restored Church of God Former Staff Member: My Exit Story

August 1, 2017, 10:14 am

≫ Next: Dave Pack: You Bring Your Assets, Don't Leave Home Without Them! No Salvation If You Don't!

≪ Previous: Restored Church of God: Dale Schurter Back In The Fold Ready To Minister To Surging RCG Membership

I first began working for the Restored Church of God Headquarters at the age of 18. Prior to that, I had only been attending with the local congregation for about a year.

As a young man, the idea that I would be getting the ultimate privilege of working for the Church’s Headquarters and being near to the Apostle conjured enough excitement to disregard my family’s many hesitations and warnings. To completely stop talking to all of my childhood friends, because I knew I was going to aspire to become different enough and I would no longer be able to associate with them. I was told my calling had drawn me out of the world, so therefore If I had friends with the world God hated that. Which actually is scriptural, but I took it to a place farther than I should have.

One of the all-encompassing lessons I was taught in the beginning was that we were to live the “Give Way” of life. That it was better to give to others and more satisfying to our lives to be living sacrifices than it was to expect from others and be given things.

I worked at the RCG HQ for only 4 years. It would have been longer but this is how it went:

At first, it was inspiring. There was a focus on studying, the truth, the people, unity, becoming wholesome people, elevating our standard to reflect God’s glory, and being lights to the world. Several ministerial trips were being made and slideshows put together, the whole HQ staff and congregation gathered for us to see our brethren from around the world and make the connection that we had a family much bigger than our minds could see. I would spend many weekends with brethren, where we would have family movie nights, dinners, game nights, and more. The camaraderie was just something to behold.

My first impression was that everyone was stiff and acted like robots. They all spoke the same, dressed the same, their hair combed, and cut perfectly. People walked fast, always In a rush. Whenever Pack would enter a room everyone would eagerly look for him to be the first to rise up at his presence. He is towering figure and a bit intimidating. We greeted each other in an awkward way the first time. And every encounter after was just me trying to get away from him as much as possible because I did not later want to be the subject of a staff meeting about how people constantly get in his way and make it difficult for him to do the work.

Anyhow, the first two years were marvelous, I found myself working seven days a week, If you didn't know, any setup and break down of the hall and other certain work at HQ was considered okay. We did a lot of it. But I didn't care I was doing something 7 days a week because I was determined to be the best serving Christian I could be. I had rose colored glasses on.

So many people at the time were moving to HQ, the staff was growing fast! There were rumors that a building was in the works.

Pack would always mention he always believed there was not enough time to build a campus so therefore we were going to focus the Church’s assets on doing the work. Resources were devoted to the Real Truth Distribution Program, Advertising was expanded. We got on to television. A hardcover book on prophecy was written. Ministers were coming to HQ for training and being sent out. Everything seemed really ok!

You almost never heard about having to give up your assets. That is…until the land was purchased and the entire Church was told a campus was going to be built. Then all the recent hires made sense. But also, an entire sermon came out on how we needed to give all that we had to the Church. From there things took many twists and turns.

Fundraising was stressed on the members as a role they needed to partake in as part of their Christian duty. The example of Israel giving everything for the building of the temple was widely used to exhort us to do the same. We were told this would be far greater than what Mr. Armstrong had accomplished with the Pasadena campus. And the timing was so that the Pasadena campus had been demolished, which led Pack to believe beginning the process of building the RCG Campus was permission from God to do so.

But as I video documented the entire build of the lower campus as part of my Job, then, I began to notice some things were off.

First off, contractors were brought from the outside to help make the buildings possible. But Pack solely relied on the HQ staff to do the bulk of the work inside and landscaping. As the months progressed the first building began to take shape quickly, but at the expense of tired staff. As I recorded, the few doing too much with too little time, they appeared terribly exhausted. Agitated. I focused a lot of the camera on the buildings themselves getting a lot of before and after.

Many would share with me their experience, often complaining. I’d listen, but never went to the ministry telling them what they had said. People needed to vent. I was learning that the rose colored glasses that had kept me in delusion were beginning to wear off.

Pack championed himself as a man of the people and a pastor at heart. Openly stating he didn't want the role of Apostle, this was a method to solicit people to feel sorry for him, a tactic I believe he loves using often to tug at the heart strings of the membership and make them believe he cares about them.

Pack is one way with the church and different with the staff. Certain things he says in a sermon is often cut out because he does not feel the entire church of world should know it. You can find him even saying this in his transcripts made public.

But during the entire build of the campus, many were overworked. Losing weight rapidly, often enduring poison ivy all over their bodies, sickness and, heat exhaustion. At times there were time crunches where lunches only lasted 30 minutes. Not enough time to get full nourishment for the hard work ahead.

Many were coming and going, that is because many were being fired. The pressure was on, suddenly Pack became so obsessed with the campus he began attacking the very people who with blood, sweat and I believe tears had dedicated everything including assets to build the buildings.

Anyone fired for a disagreement or failing to do the Job correctly were looked at as spiritual weak. IT'S NO WONDER. They had no time nor strength to study!!! People were driven to alcohol, smoking, escapades probably out of the volume of stress and feeling of emptiness.

If it were not for the faithful women there, who brought the young men food from time to time, I believe some would have gone the day without eating.

The first building was eventually completed in a year. But you could tell it was done in a hurry, there were all kinds of troubles with the first building. It was a headache. The whole staff was moved into the new building and eventually everything became about appearance and standards and keeping the campus clean to a T.

Pack instituted a big brother is watching you type of feeling among people, often encoring the staff and congregation that if they saw anyone drop trash on the campus to tell the ministry immediately. He went as far as to say during a staff meeting that you were not spiritual enough if you walked by a piece of trash on the campus and did not pick it up. What if your eye didn't catch it and someone else saw you walk by it? I’m pretty sure they’d see you as not spiritual.

You would see people scour the campus hoping to find trash so they could appear more spiritual. It was shocking!

What was supposed to be a campus for the people, for the city, for the congregation, wasn't really for those people, It was more of an empty palace! As time went on, many of the staff were laid off, even more, were fired, their sins spoken about by Pack from the pulpit to the entire church, probably to discredit them if they spoke to other members about what was going on. Soon, entire floors were closed off with only those being in executive having access. It was a hassle anytime you needed to go up to the third floor you either had to take three flights of stairs or catch the elevator at a perfect time. And if anyone saw you wondering on the third floor you were asked the reason for being up there. It was as if Pack was paranoid and began to isolate himself and those who were his loyalist also loved being enclosed up there! They had the best views, best furniture, best desks. Meanwhile, staff elsewhere had broken and falling apart desks. And we couldn't even get the latest access to software for work.

Many were made to feel bad. I was once told that Pack personally apologized to a family he had antagonized. However, he never made that public. He told the story of a young man working at HQ who asked to another staff member about a bump he had on his hand, the other staff replying to the young man it was a callus. When Pack heard that he used that story to show how young people were weak and didn't know what hard work was, thus he effectively killed the desire in that young man to do any more volunteering. That is what you got when you volunteered.

During a time that was so difficult for everyone, a time that was full of exhaustion, a desire to be better, a time where everyone was trying to get on Packs level, all he ever did was bash people, most often the young people caught the brunt of his anger. He often publicly shamed the young people, for having awful work standards and not being able to have the attention to detail he did. He once said the young people in the church couldn't take care of a gold fish let alone a cat. He made us feel bad because we didn't have the stellar upbringing he did and he couldn't understand that during that time the morale had dipped so low in the church that all people needed was encouragement.

Instead, he hunkered down and would watch from inside the air conditioned third floor glass windows like a hawk as the staff worked tireless laying out sod and mulch around huge areas and gardens. Anyone who stopped working for more than three minutes he called out.

Pack often stated that if he could he would demand the entire church work on the campus on Sundays because God said six days shall you work. Staff meetings were intense, and the entire time it was him chastising the staff for things that were being overlooked or things that were being done wrong inside and outside the buildings.

The staff was being laid off on a huge scale, many such as myself constantly reassured we would not be affected. Until we were laid off. There went four years of my life, I had given it all up. With nothing to show for, because for the four years, I struggled financially so badly my family would regularly take up fund collections to help me afford my rent not get evicted. I once ate bread for a week. Never told anyone. I once trying lifting up a stack of chairs because there weren't any dolly’s and helped and I ended up pulling a muscle, my medical costs after that reach $7,000.

Many young people were constantly moved around, the same people working on the buildings, never having a feeling of being settled. One day you could be at peace the next day, you're household would be shuffled and you could find yourself living with someone who secretly worshiped Pack.

I am thankful I had thick skin from the start. Some of the things I was told and made to feel, would have been enough to make anyone feel insecure for a long time. But I believed I was doing something good. I believed and many others that we were helping out humanity.

Instead, we were helping out Pack by bringing to life his vision of a campus he could eventually live on. He is in his own bubble. As he has stated, he has this ability to “see things that are not real”. Thinks people will eventually try and kill him, hence why he must be on the campus. The 82 part and counting series on correcting much of the prophecy he says the church misunderstood has left people even more confused.

During the almost two years that this sermon series has taken place, many have left, and the new people will have no idea that Mr. Packs failed prophecy of August 2013 has effectively ruled him as a false prophet.

He is now claiming to be the end time Elijah and therefore if Elijah was a type of Christ, he is. He has trained the staff and ministry to tell people who disagree or question something that is wrong as spiritually weak.

One particular sermon that was given during a conference explained the higher a Christian is in the pyramid of government that God laid out, the higher your vantage point is spiritually. So the people work hard to achieve that level of awareness that could allow them to “see other peoples intention and spiritual level”. It almost sounded at times like some Scientology nonsense.

Staff are underpaid. When they no longer need you, they let you go and don't even bother to check up on you only if there is a need of you again. Staff are brought back when its in the best interest of HQ. Staff meetings are basically, Pack yelling and staff never able to ask the questions they really want to ask. The buildings are mostly empty. Not enough money is coming in, so the existing number of people there have to work even more to maintain the income that is needed to pay for the campus. While others struggle to pay three tithes, Pack is enjoying a new home with a huge deck none of the members who have given it all up will ever have the pleasure of being on or having one of their own. Some of the loyal ministers at HQ routinely share with each other what was supposed to be private counsel sessions. They try and persuade you, that there must be something wrong with you. They regularly ask you about other members not keeping up with the status quo. If your haircut is off, they pounce on you like a pack of wolves, meanwhile, the same ministers walk by you as they walk into Sabbath services with their crisp pressed shirts, shined shoes, and clean shaven faces never saying hello.

The arrogance and egos and the people building up a wall around Pack are the same people no one likes to counsel with. There is no trust in them. People vent all the time. Anyone would welcome a conversation, a sincere genuine conversation where you openly talk about frustrations bothering you with the way things are done. Its considered murmuring, but some people cannot go to the ministry to release the pint up anger and hurt.

Now I am 26 years old and I realized I could no longer bare this all in, I spoke my mind several times, left the Church three months ago after giving it another shot, I was told I had been spiritually weak for a long time. No, I just got tired being told to believe the bible and then see actions that were different. I got tired of seeing peoples live uprooted, good people. People who were willing to do the right thing. Widows removed from the body for being a burden on the church. Young people shamed. Great ministers being fired or leaving. Always helping but never being helped. Played with your emotions. Confused about prophecy. Made to feel like people in the splinters were stupid and our enemies. On and on and on! What happened to the Give way of life I was told to honor? Mr. Pack has turned into something of a mad man even more so than what people already claim he is.

This is no joke, this will ruin your self-esteem and once you are either kicked out or muster the courage to leave, you are left to pick up the pieces and try to make sense of the whiplash that is being a part of RCG. You will feel unable at times to relate to people in the world. You will feel like you completely lost your sense of purpose in life. You will miss your friends who will no longer speak to you. You will fight hard to unlearn being critical of others and being a robot and all about appearances.

It has affected my friendships and sometimes my relationship with family. Now they are the ones helping me and encouraging me and giving me bits of happiness. I don't think Christ meant for a person to feel this way.

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Dave Pack: You Bring Your Assets, Don't Leave Home Without Them! No Salvation If You Don't!

August 2, 2017, 5:14 pm

≫ Next: A Tall Tale of "All things common...."

≪ Previous: Restored Church of God Former Staff Member: My Exit Story

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A Tall Tale of "All things common...."

August 3, 2017, 10:23 am

≫ Next: Art Mokarow Dies

≪ Previous: Dave Pack: You Bring Your Assets, Don't Leave Home Without Them! No Salvation If You Don't!

Dave Pack: "You Bring Your Assets, Don't Leave Home Without Them! No Salvation If You Don't!"

Even as a child, the "Bible Story" of a husband and wife in the early church under Peter being killed for "lying" about how much money they really had as opposed to what they gave to the church, seemed surreal. In the context, we are told the early church was more commune like and evidently shared with all that which each possessed to get them through.

Acts 2:44-45

And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.

Acts 4:32

And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.

Nothing wrong with this I suppose, but one would think it was rather voluntary and something that people do when they wish to drop out of society and cling unto only those that see the world as they do. It's an early practice in any group like this which tends to break down after time and everyone goes their own way again, or at least does not feel the need to share their hard earned resources and support the loners forever.

The fact is that holding all things in common during those times was a temporary state fueled by the rabid belief in the early NT Church that Jesus Second Coming was imminent. Of course, it wasn't and this practice died very quickly for two reasons. 1. As mentioned, Jesus failed to return in anyone's lifetime and dealing with how to explain it became a function of later Epistles. 2. More wealthy folk came into the church no doubt who were critically thinking enough and independent enough to simply say no.

But one has to ask why this story was included in the Book of Acts? Ask yourself what might be the result today of this happening in your church! What's wrong with this story and I will call it a story as I do not personally believe it ever really happened, but I do believe it had the desired effect on the "Church."

Acts 5

1 Now a man named Ananias, together with his wife Sapphira, also sold a piece of property. 2 With his wife's full knowledge he kept back part of the money for himself, but brought the rest and put it at the apostles' feet.

Comment: It was their property and they had the right to sell it for as much as they wished. It was nice that Ananias had such an open and trusting relationship with his wife, Sapphira, that he included her in how much he actually sold it for. While the "rules" called for everyone to share and share alike, no one has the right, save in that culture or in the "Church" it seemed, to demand ALL of it. Keeping your own money for yourself is no crime on earth or in heaven. And anyone has the right to change their mind about contributions to anyone. He brought "the rest" and that seems generous enough under any circumstances. "Putting it at the Apostles Feet" seems contrived, but if he literally did and Peter stood there whenever members brought in the goodies and shekels to be placed at his feet is this not an arrogant position that he has assumed for himself? I picture Peter standing at the front of the room standing like Mr. Clean, or Dave Pack, receiving these required contributions.

Remember, this is the Peter who denied Jesus three times with three lies of never having known the man and was forgiven in John 21, when John thought Peter was better left off the roster of Apostles worth anything to the Church. (In John's Gospel he equated with Judas as in "Judas betrayed, Peter denied. No difference. Don't follow Peter") Seems at this point of his career, Peter was not much in the mood to forgive as he had been forgiven or follow any of Jesus teachings on the topic. I'd say Peter had given Jesus lots of reasons to knock him off early in the disciple game too.

3 Then Peter said, "Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart (That's the only reason right?) that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? 4 Didn't it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn't the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied to men but to God." (So one can't just change their mind on such things?)

Comment: "Satan" could be anyone or anything. This can merely mean that Ananias made his own decision about how much he could afford to contribute. It's not like he was sharing his days wage for making pots down the street. This would have been a chunk of family change and perhaps land that had been in his family for generations. I once went to a store in Jerusalem that was in a cave of sorts and the owner said that the cave and using it for commerce had been in his family for over 800 years!

Whenever someone makes a decision the church or minister does not like or think is the right one, "Satan" often is named as the cause for this. It often means that the person simply does not see things the way the minister or church does on this topic. Besides if a literal Satan filled his heart, then forgive him and go after Satan! I always found it difficult to resist as a mere human when a rogue spirit that had access to God and was part of God's plan for testing humans was unleashed on me. I mean, come on here, human is human! I can't even resist chocolate. So at least we see it was their's to give, and somewhere along the line, what he said he would give and what he gave was the problem in Peter's mind. The lie is not in not giving it all, the lie seems to be in saying he'd give it all and then not doing that. Again, would Peter, who denied Jesus three times remember, with three lies, in a very short time, not understand his own past in this matter?

Also we have the problem of uping the ante to lying, not to Peter, or to the board, or too the treasurer. No, this young and successful couple had lied to the Holy Spirit! Yikes. One would think that lying once about how much money you had to give was like a normal lie between men. Lying three times in a short period of time about not knowing Jesus, so sure you can kill him, I don't know the man, seems more of a Holy Spirit lie, but evidently not. Peter cannot forgive what he had done himself. Maybe Peter felt he should have been punished for denying Jesus, and projected his shame and the sentence onto this poor couple, though I still doubt it ever happened in real time.

It is also interesting that Satan, an untouchable spirit caused him to lie and the Holy Spirit, an untouchable spirit strikes him down. This certainly leaves any human responsibility for these deaths in the pews out of the picture. So it's a story of church members dropping dead of no known humanly provable causes. We can hope Peter did not cut them down with a sword as he unsuccessfully tried to do in the garden lopping only the High Priests ear off in the attempt to cleave his skull.

5 When Ananias heard this, he fell down and died.(Or so they say)

No confidentiality here, or "we need to talk."
Bang...you're dead! It also says he fell down first and then died. I would think that having the Holy Spirit strike you down would be more of a "he died and fell down." Just a thought.

"And great fear seized all who heard what had happened."

Comment: WELL, THIS IS THE WHOLE POINT ISN'T IT? Even Peter understood that fear was the motivator even though something called "perfect love" had already been said to cast out fear. Fear is the opposite of Love, not hate. Peter evidently still had a lot to learn and this poor couple would pay for his ignorance. Peter only knew to cast out the person, not the fear, and that this example would lower contributions and donations to the "Work," if he didn't nip it in the bud. Or perhaps Paul, who said "perfect love casts out fear" had Luke tell this story to make a fool out of Peter. I mean, here is the Great Apostle Peter instilling fear when Paul instilled Love. Who would you follow?

6 Then the young men came forward, wrapped up his body, and carried him out and buried him.

Comment: Now have this happen in your church and see if you just get to wrap him up and throw him in the dumpster. No one felt this was wrong. No one evidently would miss him or wonder why "he went to church, but never came home." His parents were either there agreeing to this or simply learned to live that their son and daughter in law, who had that nice piece of property just vanished and somehow now we find the Church has the property. This is contrived and Apostolic cruelty and abuse at it's worse, if it happened, which it didn't. But the story makes a nice motivator of the brethren to turn in ALL the goodies. In the modern Church, all the goodies would be you're complete tithe...10%, not 9%.

7 About three hours later (Gerald Waterhouse must have been preaching this day) his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. 8 Peter asked her, "Tell me, is this the price you and Ananias got for the land?"

Comment: Three hours later than what? How long were church services anyway! Hmmm, he baits her, knowing that was not the price. Sounds like "Tell me my precious..." right out of Lord of the Rings.

"Yes," she said, "that is the price."

Comment: It would have been better to say, "we thought it over and this is what we agreed to give you." That would have put Peter on the defensive saying, "well why didn't HE say so! Oh damn, I just never asked him if maybe he told you he had agreed to something else and I just didn't know or that you both recalculated and I just phrased my question to him in a wrong way...oh my oh me." Well, no such luck.

9 Peter said to her, "How could you agree to test the Spirit of the Lord? Look! The feet of the men who buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out also."

Comment: I expect he meant the feet of those guys had dirt on them from the previous burial of her husband. I seriously doubt that this sweet couple said, "Hey, lets test the Spirit of the Lord and lie about this." Peter may have been meaning, "How could you lie to me." But then this is the same man who lied about even knowing Jesus, three times in a very short time, and to a little girl to boot! Peter denied Jesus and Judas betrayed him...what's the difference. Maybe this is the point of the story.

No...it is the point of the story. Luke was Paul's fan and not Peter's. Luke was promoting Paul and mocking Peter in this story. The original audience would have gotten that. "These two said they would do one thing, give all, and did another, held back. Punish them. The Great Peter said he would do one thing, never leave Jesus, and did another. Denied him. Ha ha... Don't follow Peter"

10 At that moment she fell down at his feet and died.

Comment: Well so much for "come let us reason together."

Then the young men came in and, finding her dead, carried her out and buried her beside her husband.

Comment: These young men are no doubt going to need some counseling of their own after this. Would you not love to have heard the talk while they dug the graves? "What the hell is this all about? I liked these people and they always gave more than any of the other sluggards in the group. Anyone here think Peter, who lied about even knowing Jesus, THREE TIMES, is nuts?" (Anyone think Dave Pack is nuts?)

11 Great fear seized the whole church and all who heard about these events.

Comment: Which is, again, the whole point of the story for the early church isn't it?

So here we have revenge killings in church of people whose hearts were filled by Satan to keep some of their own hard earned money and felled by the Holy Spirit as punishment. No chance Peter, WHO LIED ABOUT KNOWING JESUS THREE TIMES, could forgive them, or just say "thank you so much for your contribution and generosity to the Church."

No way this Peter was going to let the others think that they could get away with not having all things in common, and I mean all things. I wonder if Peter gave the Church the proceeds from his fishing boat and equipment? I guess if you said, "no way, that's my stuff," you were off the hook. The problem seems to be in saying you would and then not, but that is easily remedied by renegotiating the agreement, not MURDER!

The point is all about religious loyalty motivated by fear, guilt and shame again, isn't it? It's motivating you to stick with the church because if you don't then Satan will eat you alive or you will go to hell or burn in the lake of fire, none of which is verifiable in space and time. It's saying that hurricane Katrina was punishment on New Orleans for being full of humans who are just like the ones in Houston and Chicago and everywhere else including, of all places, Washington. It's the Rabbi saying that Bird Flu has come the the "UN-Holy Land" for that is what it is these days, because Israel allows Gay marriage, or even mixing cheese with hamburger to make a cheeseburger, when everyone knows that violates seething a calf in it's own mother's milk! No lie. I saw the posters condemning McDonalds in Tiberias...or was it McDavid's?

The story of Ananias and Sapphira is a construct to instill fear of disobeying the Church and Church leadership. We should not miss the fact that this Peter, the impetuous disciple, the "let's kick their ass for not believing in you Jesus," the "oh yeah, well I'll split your skull with my sword," LIED THREE TIMES that he ever knew Jesus and then fled. This is a contrived story to produce the desired effect...FEAR in the Church. A motivator that I am sorry to say is all to much a weapon in the ministerial arsenal of far too many churches today still.

Still there is one other motive that there might be for this rather negative story about Peter in the book of Acts. It was no secret that Luke, the author of Acts was a man of Paul. He was the apologist link, so to speak between the Jewish Church under James and the Gentile Church under Paul. It was Luke's job to make it appear that Paul got along better with Peter, James and John than he really did or they with him. There was no love lost between Peter and Paul for sure as Paul, in Galatians places Peter along with James and John in the "Apostles so called" category and reminds his readers that "I learned nothing from them."

This Peter, this man who PROMISED Jesus that he would never leave him, only to deny him three times shortly after and flee has a history. This story of the Peter, who can't abide saying one thing and doing another from Ananias and Sapphira, who SAID he was in agreement with Paul about eating with Gentiles but then withdrew when the Jewish James showed up for dinner, just might be here to poke fun of Peter, whom Paul disliked. ( I personally believe Peter's being offended with Paul was that it was obvious at dinner Paul was eating meat offered to idols which he said in Acts 15 he'd not do and did. I Corinthians 8. It had nothing to do with pork or gentiles.)

Luke is chiding Peter for his duplicity in saying one thing, like Ananias did, and doing another, as the couple is reported to have done. In short, it may be that Luke was reminding the Gentile Church that Paul, not Peter was a better leader and more to be trusted. After all, the entire book of Acts is about Paul and others only as they lead up to and introduce Paul.

Peter can dish it out, but when push came to shove in his own life, he could not take it. Peter had a history of doing exactly the same thing that he is purported to have "killed" Ananias and Sapphira for; saying one thing, and doing another. The story might be a simple mock of Peter and his so called leadership in the Church. Leadership is something Peter, Paul, James and John seemed to fight over after Jesus is supposed to have left the planet.

Interestingly enough, every time John speaks of Peter in the Gospel of John, he makes a comment about Judas, then his point about Peter and then another point about Judas...every time.

Obviously John also felt Peter's denial of Jesus was the same as Judas betrayal. John however portrays himself in his book as being the "disciple Jesus loved," reclining on Jesus breast as his best buddy, with Jesus at his trial when Peter had fled, at the foot of the cross with Jesus mom and the only one who understood what the empty tomb meant. These guys were very human and took every advantage and opportunity to put each other down while trying to elevate themselves in the eyes of the Church.

Bible guys will do that to each other in the scripture when they have a chance to point out each other's faults and foibles. Thus, I doubt the real murder of Ananias and Sapphira because they kept some of their own money ever literally happened but is a slap, by Luke, at Peter for his own duplicity. Pretty common stuff between Pastors I might add.

"All things in common" was the temporary mindset of the early early NT Church due to Jesus imminent return. I suppose Dave Pack would say they were wrong but he is right about it all now and thus can demand it. But , like HWA, building God's College, again, gives lie to the actual belief. Secluded and beautifully built homes for the chosen ones, belies the belief in the imminent coming of Christ. It can only last so long before 1. Jesus doesn't return still and times goes long. 2. Wealthy converts show up, they won't, and say "WTF are you kidding me"

↧

Art Mokarow Dies

August 5, 2017, 6:55 am

≫ Next: Dave Pack: "I’ve ordained a lot of men, who were as converted as turnips..."

≪ Previous: A Tall Tale of "All things common...."

Art Mokarow, a one-time minister of the Worldwide Church of God has died. After his departure from WCG he went on to claim he was a successful business man, but could never break his ties to Armstrongism. He was so steeped in the teachings of the church that he set himself up as another splinter with a supposed inside track to the "truth once delivered." He went on to write a prolific number of books that he calmed "proved" he was right on all kinds of subjects.

In February fo 2010, Mokarow had a public debate with Dennis Diehl. Following is part 1 of that debate (from the Journal).

WHITEHOUSE, Texas--Two former Worldwide Church of God pastors met for a one-of-a-kind event near Tyler, Texas, Feb. 21, 2010. They got together in a Church of God setting to debate whether the Bible is the inspired Word of God or not.

Art Mokarow, an 82-year-old former administrator and church pastor who left the WCG in 1979, went head to head with Dennis Diehl, a 60-year-old former WCG pastor who, since his departure from the WCG in 1998, has decided he is no longer a believer in the inerrancy and literalism of the Bible.

Mr. Mokarow, who lives in Conroe, Texas, was assisted and backed up by a friend, 62-year-old Bible scholar and former Baptist preacher from North Little Rock, Ark., Ron Moseley.

Mr. Diehl didn't mind

Dr. Moseley, who has two doctor's degrees and has studied at numerous colleges and universities, does not have a WCG background although he is a Sabbatarian Christian.

Mr. Mokarow, some weeks before the debate, checked to see if Mr. Diehl--who does believe in God although no longer in the Bible--would mind if Dr. Moseley participated, even though Dr. Moseley's participation would mean the debate would pit two against one.

But Mr. Diehl, who lives in Greenville, S.C., said that arrangement would be fine with him.

So, sitting on one side during the invariably civil discussion were Mr. Mokarow and Dr. Moseley and on the other Mr. Diehl.

The location was the building owned by the Tyler Sabbath Fellowship, whose membership and board, including elders Gary Woodring and Dennis Hughes, welcomed the debaters and the approximately 20 people who watched and listened for more than three hours on a Sunday afternoon.

How did such an event come to be?

You can read Part 1 of the debate here, and Part 2, here.

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Dave Pack: "I’ve ordained a lot of men, who were as converted as turnips..."

August 5, 2017, 10:43 pm

≫ Next: Dave Pack: No Man Has Ever Raised Up More Churches Than Me, Even After I Inherited Messed Up Pastorates

≪ Previous: Art Mokarow Dies

Now we know what is wrong with Dave's 16 ministers that are supposedly his advisors. Yes men, all, and converted as turnips!

I’ve struggled and struggled and struggled throughout my ministry, and it just bothered Mr. Armstrong to no end that he would ordain men who were not of God at all! “How could I…” He’d beat himself up. And I tried to learn from what he did, and I made many of the same mistakes! You look and you try to see who has the Holy Spirit. And it would just…he was befuddled—“I made men evangelists, who didn’t even have the Spirit of God!” Paul worked closely with two future popes!
I’ve ordained a lot of men, who were as converted as turnips, and it would bother me, because I would read the parable of the wheat and tares, and there were people who supposedly could tell the difference between the wheat and tares. And if you had the spirit of discernment, you can do a little better. But why was it I could never tell…You’re baptizing a person…You can’t tell…Did they receive the Spirit? You ordained a deacon…was he really converted? Or a deaconess, or an elder, or an evangelist. Do you see my point?
I’ve watched this for decades and the Church, in many ways, is in the “God ordained and appointed” mess that it’s in because of a whole lot of thieves and robbers, who climbed up, and nobody could see that they were! Why? And what does that have to do with the parable of the wheat and tares? And what does that have to do with being able to see the Kingdom? I’m going to explain it to you, and when I was talking to a lady, yesterday, she immediately got goose bumps. We were talking about this…so I think you will, too, but first, let’s read the parable of the wheat and tares.

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Dave Pack: No Man Has Ever Raised Up More Churches Than Me, Even After I Inherited Messed Up Pastorates

August 5, 2017, 11:23 pm

≫ Next: Dave Pack, The Cowardly Lion

≪ Previous: Dave Pack: "I’ve ordained a lot of men, who were as converted as turnips..."

God's greatest gift to humanity is none other than Dave Pack. No man in human history has ever been as awesome as he is, nor have run a church that is so superfantabulous!

I’m going to get into some things that this old shepherd struggled with, because I pastored—for decades of my life—thousands and thousands of people, and I know what “organized compactly” means, because I had to do it. I don’t even know many times. Just my time in Global, I actually built 43 congregations. I know a little something about it. Then there’s RCG. and there’s decades of my experience in Worldwide, where I worked with thousands and thousands of people. So I know what it means to be together and not—and to be close-jointed together and compacted together.

And I’ve come to understand, over time, why all of my pastorates in the Worldwide Church of God, as I entered…train-wrecks, fouled up…minister after minister, as I said last week, fired, suspended, or quit. And as I said, if President Trump likes to say he inherited a mess…I always inherited a mess and I learned how to do what we’re going to have to do. I know how to do it fast. I know how to do it worldwide. I know how to do it with people in many countries and languages, and coming from many groups. I know how to do it. It is my training for my whole life. And we’re going to have to do it. We’re going to have to prepare people for what is coming.

And now you better understand our task of preparing them. I know exactly what I’m talking about, and I’ve been uniquely prepared for this. There are many things I can’t do, brethren, many things you can’t do and many you can. There are many, many things I cannot do; but I’ve been trained to do certain things. I know how to build a pastorate. It makes no difference to me, none whatsoever, whether it’s a 100…I’ve had small pastorates. I’ve built little tiny ones. I had a pastorate of 1,100 one time, or whether it’s 10,000 or 100,000, I would know how to structure it. I’m not bragging, you know, I’ve done it.

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Dave Pack, The Cowardly Lion

August 6, 2017, 10:57 pm

≫ Next: God's ONLY True End Time Prophet Likes The Idea Of "Burkini's" For Women

≪ Previous: Dave Pack: No Man Has Ever Raised Up More Churches Than Me, Even After I Inherited Messed Up Pastorates

Poor Dave Pack.

Dave is more concerned about his personal welfare than he is boldly proclaiming his gospel to the world. Dave admits he will not go into certain neighborhoods. The only neighborhood Dave is in anymore is his cult compound in Wadsworth, Ohio. He has admitted he very seldom leaves the confines of his campus. He has further isolated himself in the middle of the compound where he is surrounded by a few of his elite men.

Dave has never been a real he man when it comes to being a fearless minister who treasures the words of Jesus over hiding in some lily-white COG Steppford neighborhood.

Praying for the escape of brethren becomes so much more meaningful—and daily—with this new knowledge. Most of God’s people live in dangerous areas of the world, but when I say that, it’s a different world. Who is to say what is and is not dangerous, if you’re in a mall, on a train, or just walking out of a building and there’s a shooter. So I stay out of dangerous neighborhoods.

Some COG ministers over the decades went into the dangerous neighborhoods that impotent Dave avoids. They valued their message and their God more than they did their lives, something that Dave is incapable of understanding.

Poor old Dave.

↧

God's ONLY True End Time Prophet Likes The Idea Of "Burkini's" For Women

August 7, 2017, 9:35 am

≫ Next: Is It Profitable To Seek "Wise Counsel" From A COG Minister?

≪ Previous: Dave Pack, The Cowardly Lion

Why is it that so many of the ministry of the Church of God are sexually titillated by women in such a way that they need to have women cover up every bare inch of skin so that they, the holy men of God, cannot be tempted. Are they that weak and immature? Why is lust such a problem for COG ministers? It's not like many women would be lusting after these men!

Today, we have God's most knowledgeable right-hand man/boy prophet, approving of the burkini's that many Muslim women wear tot he beach.

Almost-arrested and jailed, Elisha, Elijah, Joshua, Habakkuk, Amos, doubly blessed, apostle, prophet, future martyr, bitter "son" of the late Rod Meredith, and Chief Overseer, Bob Thiel, has a posting up today about Germany attacking France, because France refuses to allow burkini's on their beaches.

Elijah Thiel wrote this:

The following was reported by the German press:
7 August 2017
A Muslim woman was barred from using a swimming pool at a vacation home in southern France because she wore a burkini bathing suit, the Collective Against Islamophobia in France (CCIF) said on its website. …
The owner of the vacation home told the family that the pool needed to be drained and cleaned since the woman had used it. He then reportedly withheld the family’s 490-euro ($577) deposit in order to pay for the cleaning fees. …
The CCIF dismissed the house owner’s claims that the woman’s suit was unhygienic, as burkinis are made from elastic synthetic fabrics used for wetsuits and other types of swimwear. Burkinis cover all areas of the body except for the face, hands and feet.
Controversy over the full-body swimsuit erupted in France last summer when several communities along the French Riviera banned burkinis on public beaches.
The bans were eventually struck down by France’s highest administrative court, which said they constituted serious and illegal violations of fundamental freedoms. http://www.dw.com/en/woman-barred-from-french-vacation-home-pool-over-burkini/a-39984955

And then had to add this:

Women should be able to wear full body bathing suits when swimming, etc.
Notice something that the Apostle Paul wrote:
8 I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting; 9 in like manner also, that the women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with propriety and moderation, (1 Timothy 2:8-9)
The idea that women need to be almost totally naked to swim in a pool is wrong.

Promoting lust is wrong, promoting modesty is not.

Many ministers in the Church of God have had profound issues with lust. They have stalked, molested and raped COG girls and women. Their hearts have been filled with depravity. Apparently, Elijah Thiel has some issues he needs to deal with in order to over come the pollution of his heart.

Mark 7:21-23The Message (MSG)
20-23 He went on: “It’s what comes out of a person that pollutes: obscenities, lusts, thefts, murders, adulteries, greed, depravity, deceptive dealings, carousing, mean looks, slander, arrogance, foolishness—all these are vomit from the heart. There is the source of your pollution.”

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Is It Profitable To Seek "Wise Counsel" From A COG Minister?

August 7, 2017, 10:00 am

≫ Next: Church of God Big Sandy Scandal Continues

≪ Previous: God's ONLY True End Time Prophet Likes The Idea Of "Burkini's" For Women

Living Church of God has a little blurb up by Doug Winnail about seeking "wise counsel" from the ministry and others instead of not relying upon your own intuition on some things.

Given the abysmal track record of the ministry of the COG interfering and destroying lives of their members due to their "wise counsel," why would any COG member in this day and age EVER considered a minister telling them what they should or should not be doing? Most COG ministers are not trained to actually do "wise counselling." They rely only upon gut feelings, just as the person who is seeking counsel is doing.

CAD Comments - Friday, August 04, 2017
The Value of Counsel
One common pitfall in life is trusting in our own judgment when we only see part of the picture or when we only see what we want to see. When we make decisions or take actions based on how we feel or how we see a situation, the results can be costly for ourselves and for others. This is why Solomon advised in Proverbs 3:5, “lean not on your own understanding,” and in Proverbs 3:7, “Do not be wise in your own eyes,” and again in Proverbs 28:26, “He who trusts in his [or her] own heart is a fool…” Solomon also warned in Proverbs 14:12, “There is a way that seems right to a man [or to a woman], but its end is the way of death.” To help us avoid making serious mistakes in life, God inspired Solomon to write in Proverbs 11:14, “Where there is no counsel, the people fall; but in a multitude of counselors there is safety” and again in Proverbs 15:22, “Without counsel, plans go awry, but in the multitude of counselors they are established.” We can obtain wise counsel from parents, the ministry, and from older, more experienced friends, relatives and associates who can be objective and help us see a bigger picture than we perceive on our own. Seeking wise counsel is a habit we can develop that will help us succeed and avoid making serious mistakes.
Have a profitable Sabbath,
Douglas S. Winnail

Of course, there is nothing wrong with seeking wise counsel on different issues and circumstances in life. People who have the experience or been in similar situations have a multitude of knowledge to share. Many of the ministry in the Church of God do not. Their so-called training has come from booklets and sermons, not from spending hundreds of hours taking training on how to be empathetic listeners. Instead, they lash out with absurd and sometimes dangerous conclusions that members are required to follow, or else they are kicked to the curb. Truly, is there an LCG minister actually trained by an outside college or institution, in therapy and counseling?

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Church of God Big Sandy Scandal Continues

August 7, 2017, 1:47 pm

≫ Next: New Song About Bob Thiel and The Improperly Named "continuing" Church of God

≪ Previous: Is It Profitable To Seek "Wise Counsel" From A COG Minister?

Church of God Big Sandy

From a Texas source:

Church of God Big Sandy Scandal Continues

The situation in the Church of God Big Sandy continues to draw attention. And not just because David Havir III was determined to have acted “inappropriately” with a minor girl by Wood County, Texas, Judge Jeff Fletcher on July 6, 2017. (Case number 2017-357).

There are now questions about David III’s relationship with the minor girl’s older sister, Karina, who is 19 years old. In the same way that David III says he is a father figure to the younger sister, he also claims his relationship with this older girl is the same. He has told others that she lives with him and his wife and daughter.

It may be relevant that a COGBS board member abruptly resigned recently. No public explanation has been given for his resignation. Some have wondered if it could be because he disapproves of David III’s recent behavior. This board member has two young daughters who have been involved in the COGBS youth program.

Further, questions about COGBS have now moved from morality to finance. In order to understand this, it is important to understand the inner workings of COGBS.

COGBS has always had an elected board. From its very beginning, the board would set an annual budget. Within that budget was a private fund for the pastor to administer. The board members were never allowed to review the expenditures (which are done at Pastor Dave’s sole discretion) of this private fund because Pastor Dave said it would be a “violation of minister/parishioner confidentiality”. Pastor Dave insists that any money given from the fund to a recipient should be done with complete privacy.

The exception to this privacy rule was Treasurer Don Mishnick. Don reviewed all transactions out of Pastor Dave’s private fund. This exception to the minister/parishioner privacy rule is interesting because Don is not a minister. Nevertheless, since Don was the treasurer and perhaps the biggest contributor to COGBS, the board has always just shrugged its collective shoulders about this policy and gone along with it. They assumed that, if there were an improper expenditure from Pastor Dave’s private fund, Don (who is notoriously frugal) would quickly blow the whistle and get the problem corrected.

This arrangement went on for many years until Don resigned from the board and also gave up his membership at COGBS. He now attends church elsewhere because he had a falling out with Pastor Dave over (get this) David III’s spending of church money to take his youth group to Winter Family Retreat in Lexington KY.

And who has since taken Don’s place in overseeing Pastor Dave’s secret fund? You guessed it. Several months ago, the board of directors appointed David III to be the treasurer of COGBS! It is now David III who provides financial oversight over his father’s secret fund expenditures!

What a sweet deal the Havir family has fallen into. If only David III could have hung on at CEM, the Havir family would be sitting in tall cotton with access to the funds of two of the biggest ACOG groups in east Texas.

Like too many churches, the attitude of COGBS leadership has been, “We all know each other. We trust each other. Surely we can trust our brothers and sisters in these matters.” Anyone with any sense knows that this attitude can lead to disaster.

From all of this, it can be reasonably deduced that the current (and past) members of the COGBS board do not understand their responsibility as board members. The bylaws of COGBS clearly state that the board of directors manages that church. This is clearly written within the first lines of the bylaws. The bylaws do NOT give management of the church to the pastor, even though this has been the de facto situation during most of COGBS’s existence.

If the current board is to really perform its fiduciary responsibilities to COGBS, they will ask the following questions to the Havirs in an open board meeting and not in closed executive session. The membership of that church and contributors to that church deserve answers to these questions:

1) Who paid for David III’s legal fees in his recent court hearing regarding his judicially-declared inappropriate relationship with the minor girl? If these fees were paid for by COGBS, did the funds come from Pastor Dave’s secret fund or was it an expenditure that was approved by a vote of the board? (The current board has three new members who were not on the board when the David III scandal began so they might not be aware of the previous board’s actions.)

2) Has David III ever received financial assistance from Pastor Dave’s secret fund? If so, how much has he received? It is no secret that David III has had problems finding and keeping jobs over the past five years.

3) Has David III ever been employed by COGBS? This question is germane because Pastor Dave once vowed never to put anyone else on the church payroll again. This was after the church had hired a part-time sound man and then let him go. After that incident, Pastor Dave made it very clear that, from that moment on, he would be the only person employed the COGBS. So, if David III has received funds from COGBS, did he receive these funds as an employee or contract worker? Or did he receive them as a “needy person” under the auspices of financial aid from the secret fund?

4) Besides widows, who has received money from the COGBS secret fund? If a non-widow has received funds, how does the amount compare with how much widows usually receive?

5) Are COGBS bills being paid late at this time? If so, is it because of a cash flow problem or is it because of mismanagement by the church treasurer? Have any of the widows’ checks recently been late?

It was no secret that, as long Don Mishnick was present to financially prop up COGBS, the church would do just fine in the area of income. They might continue hemorrhaging members, but they would be kept financially afloat. Now that Don is gone, it is feared that this church organization will eventually go bankrupt. Is it possible that the Havir family realizes that inevitability and they are now milking as much money out of the COGBS treasury while they can? Do the Havirs see the handwriting on the wall and are they preparing to bail?

An outside, external audit is needed for COGBS. There is no one currently on the board who is qualified to review the books to determine whether or not there have been inappropriate expenditures. Any audit should be done by a qualified accounting firm that has experience in business audits.

If an outside audit exonerates the Havir family and if the board of directors unanimouslyconcludes that all post-Don Mischnick expenditures are on the up-and-up, the church should say so via a public announcement in a publication such as The Journal. Even though the Journal no longer has a significant number of subscribers, any such announcement in The Journal would subsequently get spread on the internet for all the various ACOGs to see.

In the meantime, any parent whose child is involved in David III’s youth program should be wary. Parents should be asking whether or not it is wise to send an underage girl to the COGBS annual summer camp at Timberline Baptist Church in Lindale, Texas.

And, until a professional audit is completed with all questions answered, anyone who contributes money to COGBS does so at his/her own peril.

If the Havir family and the COGBS board of directors are truly desirous of doing the right thing and avoiding all appearance of evil, they will take the proper steps to assure their church members (and the public) that this church organization, its leadership, and its policies/procedures involving money and underage children are above reproach.

Let’s see if the COGBS board of directors is willing to step up to the plate and do its job. It’s never happened before with a COGBS board, so this could be a first. By giving the Havir family unchecked power to run that church, the COGBS has entered into a Faustian Bargain that will come back to haunt them probably sooner than later.

↧

New Song About Bob Thiel and The Improperly Named "continuing" Church of God

August 7, 2017, 10:49 pm

≫ Next: The World's Foremost Prophet and Trumpologist, Bob Thiel and the 101 Dalmatians

≪ Previous: Church of God Big Sandy Scandal Continues

↧

The World's Foremost Prophet and Trumpologist, Bob Thiel and the 101 Dalmatians

August 8, 2017, 11:04 am

≫ Next: UCG and its leadership problems

≪ Previous: New Song About Bob Thiel and The Improperly Named "continuing" Church of God

Oh, wait....wrong story!

Almost arrested and jailed Bob Thiel is on his blog today bragging about how he has scored his 101st radio interview. The idea that any radio host would deem Thiel a legitimate theology/prophecy source shows how little research these hosts have actually done.

Habakkuk Thiel imagines himself an impeachable authority on President Donald Trump. His prophetic utterances on Trump are so significant that he wrote a book on the subject, which in turn led a radio host to interview him.

As long-term readers are aware, I, Dr. Bob Thiel, AKA COGwriter have frequently been a radio guest. However, because of scheduling and other issues they are usually not announced here.
But sometimes they are.

Today, I am scheduled to be on The Morning Show with Mike Hogan. This would be on KHUB 1340 AM out of Freemont, Nebraska. August 8th 9:30 am CDT/7:30 am PDT. The host and I expect to discuss prophetic aspects Donald Trump’s presidency and items related to my book Donald Trump and America’s Apocalypse.

Unless it is preempted or something, this will be the 101st radio appearance since the formation of the [improperly named] Continuing Church of God on 12/28/12. My 102nd radio interview is scheduled for the Republic Broadcasting Network (RBN) Friday, August 11th at 12:00 pm CDT.

I guess in a way it is good that Elijah Thiel is getting on these programs and letting the world further see what a theologically bankrupt fool he is.

So why is the dubiously blessed prophet hopping on the radio to share his false prophecies? Because Herb did! Who would have guessed?

Of course, being on radio is something that COG leaders have done since no later than the 1930s. Radio was used so much to proclaim the gospel of the kingdom and other biblical messages, that after he left CG7, the late Herbert W. Armstrong initially named his group the Radio Church of God.

Bitter Bob Thiel then trots out a quote from Leroy Neff from 1959 about how God opened a door that no man can shut. Remember the myth that the church used to teach that radio was specifically invented so that the church could spread the gospel, just like the printing press was invented so that HWA could send out mimeographs of his "Plain Truth", or that airplanes were invented so that HWA and other prophets of the church could fly around the world witnessing to world leaders. Apparently, Elisha Thiel still is stupid enough to believe this. The door cannot be shut on his church, even though he insistently is whining that it is about to be.

Revelation 3:7-13: “And to the angel of the Church in Philadelphia write these things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that OPENETH, and no man SHUTTETH; and SHUTTETH and no man openeth.” The great door that God has opened to this work is the facility to go into all the world and preach the gospel; the door of radio, the door of the printing press, plus many other such doors. God has set before us an open door and no MAN can shut it. God can shut it, and He will when the work is finished and the Philadelphia Church goes to a place of safety. “I know thy works: Behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name” (verse 8).

Notice that this Church has works. It has works of ZEAL and of REPENTANCE. This Church has only a little strength. But, by contrast, the Church of Laodicea believes that IT is increased with goods and has a great deal of strength. Philadelphia has little strength to do this great work that God has given it to do. God has opened the door, and yet look how insignificant, how weak, how little strength we as a Church have to do that work. How much we lack in every way, and yet God has opened the door and has given us certain vital, supernatural, spiritual gifts. Very often we lack enough money to pay the radio bills and other expenses. WE ARE FEW IN NUMBER, while many other eras of the Church of God numbered in the hundreds of thousands. We indeed have little strength. And yet, look at the great power that God has placed before us. (Neff L. What Is the LAODICEAN CHURCH? Good News, August 1959)

Ah yes, that same worn out story that "we are few in number" and therefore MUST be the one true church. It was a lie then and is still a lie today.

We in the [Improperly named] Continuing Church of God are going through the open doors in radio as well as with the printing press, the internet, travel, and personal contact. This includes to areas, like Africa, with Gentiles.

How long do we have to wait for false prophet Thiel to be jetting off to see world leaders with a piece of Steuben Crystal in his briefcase or his big thick Bible so he can thrust it in the face of world leaders? If Gerald Flurry can be setting himself up to do this, why can't Amos Thiel? But then, Flurry is a liar and a false teacher just like the African Bwanna Thiel is.

↧

UCG and its leadership problems

August 8, 2017, 9:07 pm

≫ Next: Ron Weinland: After Realizing His Members Are Not Sending In Enough Money, He Says: "Do you think I’m stupid as God’s apostle?"

≪ Previous: The World's Foremost Prophet and Trumpologist, Bob Thiel and the 101 Dalmatians

Recently at a UCG conference, Vic Kubik made the following comment:

Mr. Kubik showed his appreciation for the spirit of fellowship amongst the elders.
He touched on the reasoning for the recent Church-wide fast and pointed to
the spiritual purpose of fasting: “to humble ourselves before God and draw closer
to Him and to make His purpose our purpose.” Mr. Kubik emphasized that what is
important is that we develop strong relationships among God’s people and that we
are ready to pass on knowledge and the work of the Church to the younger generation
when the time comes. Mr. Kubik also touched on the questions about the
structure and function of Ministerial and Member Services.

If this was actually a practice that UCG wants to see happen, then WHY does it still pad the Council of Elders and other management leadership with men who were part of WCG? No new younger faces ever appear in any of the updates to the Council. Just the same tired old men who played with WCG members lives while they plotted and schemed in the background to start a new splinter group. Most of these men were without ethics or empathy when they were WCG ministers and it is no different now.

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Ron Weinland: After Realizing His Members Are Not Sending In Enough Money, He Says: "Do you think I’m stupid as God’s apostle?"

August 8, 2017, 10:10 pm

≫ Next: Wade Cox: Yes, I am truly this stupid when it comes to uttering prophecies

≪ Previous: UCG and its leadership problems

Why is it that the Church of God has produced so many imbeciles pretending to be God's chosen vessels? Between Bob Thiel and Ron Weinland, I have to wonder if the Church of God has finally scraped the bottom of the barrel. Can the Church of God have two bigger idiots in its midst?

After hundreds of failed prophecies, a prophetic 3 1/2 years in jail, married to an equally corrupt wife and the father to two money-grubbing kids, Ron Weinland still has a few hundred mentally ill followers. Followers who are NOT sending in enough money to keep Weinerdude and his sick family in their accustomed lifestyles.

To this day there are people still stealing from God! And I think, “What are you doing? You think I’m ignorant? Do you think I’m stupid as God’s apostle?” Your time is running out. You’ve got just a few weeks left and you’re gone – all of you – because there’s more than one. There are too many and if you don’t get it turned around immediately and repent before God it’s sayonara, dos vedanya, auf wiedersehen. And I know you’re only speaking English so it’s goodbye. Sick. In God’s Church we serve God. We seek to obey God in everything we do. There’s no such thing as being able to have adultery in God’s Church. There is no such thing as stealing from God, and on and on it goes. Those things aren’t allowed in God’s Church! We can’t just come the way we are. God says we’re to change. We’re to think differently. If people don’t, and if people want to play games and go through the motions, like send in maybe 5% or 3% just to kind of keep in the doorway, just keep the foot in the door a little bit and say, “I’m doing it. I’m doing it.” You lying liar! Stealing from God Almighty! How on earth can anyone of a right mind do such things? That blows my mind! It really does.

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Wade Cox: Yes, I am truly this stupid when it comes to uttering prophecies

August 9, 2017, 2:42 pm

≫ Next: Allie Dart Has Died

≪ Previous: Ron Weinland: After Realizing His Members Are Not Sending In Enough Money, He Says: "Do you think I’m stupid as God’s apostle?"

Another Church of God minister who has been an utter failure is Wade Cox. He has made so many prophecies that have failed that he, Bob Thiel and Ron Weinland are in competition to see who is the biggest Church of God liar.

Cox is so far out there that he claims the Koran is a holy book for Christians to be using and that his "god" created a race of human Elohims who have been running around on the earth ever since creation. They were actually created before his fake "jesus" was created.

Added to all of that wackiness is Wade Cox's prophetic timeline:

2012 Thirty-fifth year of the fortieth Jubilee. Sabbath year and end of the Mayan Calendar and the Sun system. The Whore is destroyed by the Beast from this date and finally by the advent of the Messiah after the period of the two Witnesses, perhaps by 2018-2019. FAILED

2016 Passover is the probable last time for the two Witnesses to be in place in Jerusalem. Droughts of the two Witnesses commence. FAILED

2019 Probable last date for the return of the Messiah and the subjugation of the planet given the 2028 commencement for the millennial system and the time being cut short. GURANTEED TO FAIL

Kings of the East called down to Jerusalem and destroyed. GURANTEED TO FAIL

2025 Perhaps less than 500 million people left alive on the planet. GURANTEED TO FAIL

2025/26 Treble Harvest year for the Jubilee GURANTEED TO FAIL

2026/27 Sabbath Year NOT RELEVANT

2027 End Day 6
GURANTEED TO FAIL

2027/2028 Fortieth Jubilee since Messiah and Forty-ninth since the second Temple and Ezra/Nehemiah. GURANTEED TO FAIL

2028 Beginning of the Jubilee of Jubilees from 1 Abib. The fiftieth Jubilee since the construction of the Temple and the restoration of the Temple and the Law under Ezra and Nehemiah GURANTEED TO FAIL

The one thousand year millennial reign of Jesus Christ begins. The planet is run in peace and prosperity according to God’s Laws for 1000 years. GURANTEED TO FAIL

3015-3027 Satan is released and the last war of the end begins. GURANTEED TO FAIL

3028 The General Resurrection of the Dead GURANTEED TO FAIL

The 100-year Judgment. GURANTEED TO FAIL

3127 The City of God is complete and the Universe is structured anew. GURANTEED TO FAIL

Here is what the Bible, the other book that Cox claims to follow, has to say about him and his teachings:

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity [lawlessness].

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Allie Dart Has Died

August 9, 2017, 10:00 pm

≫ Next: Ambassador Properties For Sale

≪ Previous: Wade Cox: Yes, I am truly this stupid when it comes to uttering prophecies

From CEM

Allie Dart passed away this morning at 8:52, listening to Ron's sermon "A Good Marriage." She went peacefully with Sammie, her aide, by her side. Thanks for your prayers, flowers, and cards of encouragement for her during this trial. She has finished her race--she is no longer in pain as she waits for the resurrection.

Monday, August 14 at 10am at Stewart Family Funeral Home in Tyler with
Mr. Wesley White officiating. Visitation will be 30 minutes prior to the service.
Burial will follow at Whitehouse Memorial Cemetery.

Monday, August 14 at 10am at Stewart Family Funeral Home in Tyler withMr. Wesley White officiating. Visitation will be 30 minutes prior to the service.Burial will follow at Whitehouse Memorial Cemetery.

We have arranged for her service to be streamed live on the Internet via the funeral homes website.

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Ambassador Properties For Sale

August 10, 2017, 9:27 am

≫ Next: "...And Knowledge Shall Be Increased" You Say That Like It's a Bad Thing

≪ Previous: Allie Dart Has Died

Former faculty home: LaRavia's and Tkach Jr.

Welcome to the Dr. Henry H. Sherk House. This is a unique opportunity to own a part of the Ross Grove Landmark District along the historic South Orange Grove’s Millionaire’s Row, across from the prestigious Tournament of Roses! Famous architect JJ Blick originally built the Dutch Colonial Revival in 1892, and distinguished Pasadena physician/surgeon (Dr. Sherk) later commissioned another renowned architect (Edward C. Kent) to expand the home in 1908 into its current spacious layout — 6 beds, 4 baths at 4,482 SF.

$2,495,000.00

268 S Orange Grove Blvd, Pasadena, CA 91105

Terrace Villa: former women's dorm

Terrace Villa, a lavish 1924 Italian Revival Villa designed by noted California architect Walter C. Folland. This 8,000 s.f. +/- residence, flanked by the grand Mayfair & Merritt mansions, commands sweeping views of the vast Great Lawn & San Gabriel Mountains & once overlooked Terrace Drive on Millionaire's Row.

$4,800,000.00

Terrace Villa: New York Times

Former women's dorm, home of Feazell's and Tkach Sr.

The Bella N. Scofield house, designed by famed architect Frederick L. Roehrig, is one of the largest remaining original homes on Millionaire’s Row. This home embodies the Prairie Style Craftsman architecture with its strong horizontal lines, sweeping porches and wide overhanging eaves with decorative details.

$3,498,000.00

280 S. Orange Grove Blvd

Ambassador Hall: Used for class rooms and receptions

The Merritt Mansion, one of Los Angeles’ most historic spaces, is currently for sale for just under $8 million. Location on South Orange Grove Boulevard, the 17,329 square-foot residence includes nine bedrooms, three bathrooms, two security vaults and an underground swimming pool decked out with locker rooms and all. Built in 1905 by celebrated millionaire Hulett C. Merritt who made his big money in the railway and steel industries, the property was featured in the opening scenes of "The Millionaire," a popular 1950's TV series.

$7,900,000.00

Merritt Mansion

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"...And Knowledge Shall Be Increased" You Say That Like It's a Bad Thing

August 11, 2017, 6:15 am

≫ Next: No Matter Where You Go In The World, We All Think The Same...

≪ Previous: Ambassador Properties For Sale

I believe most here can recall the great proofs that evolution could not possibly true because , well it just can't be true if Genesis is literally true. Top Church paleontologists like Herbert W. Armstrong, Garner Ted and others with clever titles and in colorful, yet short, booklets, took on all worldly trained paleontologists, cosmologists and archaeologists and exposed their lifetime work in the field as nonsense. From the comfort of their office chairs and obvious ability to just make stuff up without proper inquiry, theories for the birds and whales of tales were exposed for the frauds they were.

Top paleontologist, cosmologist, biologist, archaeologist and theologian David C. Pack is the latest Top Church of God Scientist to tackle these fishy issues having learned the truth about evolution a full 50 years ago in Second Year Bible where the Church destroyed all doubt by having him outline Whitcomb and Morris's The Genesis Flood with no actual discussion on the contents ever as if they could.

However, Dave lost.....