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Exposing the underbelly of Armstrongism in all of its wacky glory! Nothing you read here is made up. Every crazy, weird and wacky quote is straight from the pens of Armstrongite leaders or members who think they possess some insight into God and the Bible. What you read here is the up to date face of Herbert W Armstrong's legacy. It's the gritty and dirty behind the scenes look at Armstrongism as you have never seen it before!

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    Kathleen has a relevant post up about ht use of holistic medicine in "treating" children's medical issues.  Growing up in the church this was common practice since going to doctor's was strictly prohibited.  That anointed cloth was the cure all along with lemon juice, honey, vinegar and whisky for colds and Mogen David wine for cuts and scrapes.

    There are lots of bright, loving parents out there who are afraid of or have a problem with medical science. So when their kids get sick, they "treat" them with "alternative medicines." What's wrong with that?

    First of all, most parents aren't familiar with the course a disease takes, so they can mistake what appears to be "getting better" for actually getting worse, much, much worse.

    Second, "alternative medicines" that have stood the test of time--that work--aren't called alternative medicine; they're called medicine. Props to Tim Minchin.

    Here's why you don't want to "treat" your child with holistic medicines to the exclusion of proper care from a licensed healthcare provider: In a heartbreaking case, Tamara Lovett, a Canadian mom from Calgary, Alberta "treated" her seven-year- old son, Ryan, who was sick with not just one, but several treatable illnesses, with "holistic medicines." He died. Had she taken him promptly to a medical doctor, he would be alive today. She stood trial and was found guilty of "failing to provide the necessaries of life, causing death." I don't want that to happen to you. More important, I don't want your child to die unnecessarily. 

    Now there is reason to be concerned about the over-use of antibiotics, and you should talk to a licensed healthcare provider if you are wondering about that. There's also a very helpful book available to help you talk intelligently with that doctor. Breaking the Antibiotic Habit: A Parent's Guide to Coughs, Colds, Ear Infections, and Sore Throats by Paul A. Offit, MD. Caution: reading this book, even repeatedly, does not make you a licensed healthcare provider, and you need to take your child to a real one. Use this book to help you have intelligent conversations with healthcare providers.   

    So if you like using, say, "aroma therapy," knock yourself out; it will make your house smell good. But when your kids are sick, for God's sake, for your own sake, and most importantly for your children's sake, take them to a licensed healthcare provider. 
    Dying for God's Sake

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    We have all watched as Dave Pack has endlessly declared he has the most superfantabulous Church of God to ever exist in this dispensation of the Church of God movement.  He has the best web sites, the most beautiful campus, the best magazines, the most astounding sermons, and the most loyal group of ministers the church has ever had.

    We now know that is all just hot air blowing out of Wadsworth.

    God's most important and best Church of God ever in the 6,000 yeas of bible history is now centered in Arroyo Grande, California!  Kneel in awe!

    What's that you say?  Arroyo Grande?  I bet you thought Church of God's picked "crown jewels" like Pasadena, or other beautiful locations like Cincinnati to headquarter their empires in.  But no,  Arroyo Grande has the most notable distinction of dramatically growing as a city in the 1970-1980's due to the expansion of its waste water treatment plant.  Awesome!  A city that grew because of human waste!  How prophetic of Almost-arrested, Elisha, Elijah, Amos, Joshua, Habakuk,  Doubly Blessed, Apostle, Prophet, End Time Witless Witness, Chief Overseer Bob Thiel to pick such a location.  It seems appropriate that he would pick a city with a large waste treatment plant to resurrect his dreamy church in when all he is peddling is the waste and dregs of Armstrongism.  Apostle Thiel is the Church of God's very own Elmer Gantry, out to save the world while his own life is a mess.

    Habakkuk Thiel is bragging about how successful he is as a church leader and that he has reached more humans with his fledgling personality cult than any other Church of God has, especially when it compares to Rod Meredith and Dave Pack's outreach to the world.

    Habakkuk Thiel claims he has preached a sermon about EVERY single topic Jesus has been recorded saying. Has Rod Meredith or Dave Pack ever done that?  Apparently not since Thiel has to point this out for us all.

    As far as Matthew 28:19-20 goes, one way that the Continuing Church of God. has done that is by teaching everything that Jesus is recorded to have said in the New Testament. Below are links to sermons that demonstrate that:  (after each book below he listed his many sermons preached in front of his crooked bookcases or flowery sheer curtains)
    MATTHEW Here are links to twelve sermons covering the 28 chapters of Matthew: 
    MARK Here is a link to a sermon covering all of Jesus’ words in the ‘Gospel of Mark’: 
    LUKE Here are links to eight sermons covering the entire ‘Gospel of Luke’:  
    The last sermon also covers Jesus’ words in the Book of Acts.
    JOHN Here are links to a seven-part sermon series covering the entire ‘Gospel of John’: 
    REVELATION This is a link to a sermon covering words Jesus spoke as recorded in the Book of Revelation and in first and second Corinthians: Revelation: Jesus’ Final Words. 
    All of that preaching about what Jesus said and yet the man still has no clue as to what the Jesus did or accomplished. Totally clueless.

    Next the dreamy prophet wants you to know how awesome his group is by the number of languages that he has translated some of his bible thumping into:

    As far as languages go, notice the list of languages that we have links to...

    International Languages

    Afrikaans Afrikaans
    Albanian Shqip
    Amharic አማርኛ
    Arabic العَرَبِيَّة
    Armenian հայերէն
    Basque Euskara
    Belarusian беларуская мова
    Bengali বাংলা 
    Bosnian Bosanski
    Bulgarian български
    Burmese မြန်မာစာ
    Catalan Català
    Cebuano Bisayâ
    Chichewa Nyanja
    Croatian Hrvatski
    Corsican Corsu
    Czech Český
    Danish Dansk 
    Dutch Nederlands
    Esperanto Esperanto
    Estonian Eesti keel
    Finnish Suomalainen
    French Français
    Frisian Frisian
    Galician Galego
    German Deutsch
    Greek Ελληνική
    Gujarati ગુજરાતી
    Haitian Creole Kreyòl Ayisyen
    Hausa Hausa
    Hawaiian Ōlelo Hawaiʻi
    Hebrew עִברִית
    Hindi हिंदी
    Hmong Hmong
    Hungarian Magyar
    Icelandic Íslenska
    Igbo Igbo
    Indonesian Bahasa Indonesia
    Irish Gaeilge
    Italian Italiano
    Japanese 日本語
    Javanese Jawa
    Kannada ಕನ್ನಡ
    Kazakh Қазақ тілі
    Khmer ភាសាខ្មែរ
    Kiswahili Kiswahili
    Korean 한국어
    Kurdish Kurdî 
    Kyrgyz кыргызча
    Lao ພາສາລາວ
    Latin Latinae
    Latvian Latviešu valoda
    Lithuanian lietuvių
    Luxembourgish Lëtzebuergesch
    Macedonian Македонски
    Malagasy Malagasy
    Malay Bahasa Melayu
    Malayalam മലയാളം 
    Maltese Malti
    Maori Te Reo
    Mandarin (Chinese) 普通话
    Marathi मराठी 
    Mongolian Монгол
    Nepali नेपाली
    Norwegian Norsk
    Polish Polskie
    Portuguese Português
    Punjabi ਪੰਜਾਬੀ ਦੇ
    Romanian Română
    Russian Rusă
    Samoan Gagana fa’a Sāmoa
    Scots Gaelic Gàidhlig
    Serbian Српски
    Sesotho Sesotho
    Shona chiShona
    Sinhalese සිංහල
    Slovak Slovenčina
    Slovenian Slovenščina
    Somali Af-Soomaali
    Spanish Español
    Sundanese Sundanese
    Swedish Svenska
    Tagalog Tagolog
    Tamil தமிழ்
    Thai ภาษาไทย
    Turkish Türkไทย
    Urdu اردو
    Uzbek Oʻzbekcha
    Vietnamese Tiếng Việt
    Welsh Cymraeg
    Xhosa isiXhosa
    Yiddish יידיש
    Zulu isiZulu
    So?  What is the point?  Just because you translate a booklet into the native language of certain countries does NOT mean you have been a witness to the nation.   Thousands of Christian missionaries have already done a far better work than Thiel will EVER do in those nations.  Besides, I can put a translate button on this very blog and reach hundreds of native tongues.  Is that really being a witness?  Not at all.  Even though this blog has reached 216 nations, it ultimately does not mean a thing.  Ultimately those figures are just as worthless as Thiel's list of languages.

    The Doubly Blessed false prophet then makes the claim that his little group will soon be the fulfillment of Revelation 7.  It is quit appropriate that Thiel lives next to a waster plant, as his claim is a steaming pile of bullshit!

    We are setting ground work for the fulfillment of Revelation 7, for as God’s word says there will be:
    9 a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues (Revelation 7:9)
    14 “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. (Revelation 7:14)
    The narcissistic and delusional false prophet will NEVER take a witness to the entire world and will certainly NEVER be a fulfillment of Revelation 7.  That is an indisputable fact!   He is no more going to do this than Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry, or Rod Meredith is going to.  That is an indisputable fact too!

    Amos Thiel then claims his "jesus" will soon open doors for him around the world.  How can that be when Thiel dose not even know the man or anything about him?  Sure he throws the name around a couple times in a sermon or magazine article, usually saved for the last few paragraphs.

    Philadelphian Christians realize that they need to go through the doors that Jesus opens (Revelation 3:7-9) and that includes reaching people in as many languages as the doors open to do so.
    He then ends his "fact list" with rather comical statement:

    Although we have a lot more to do, we in the CCOG are leading The Final Phase of the Work. 


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    Rod Meredith has his latest co-worker/member letter up and shockingly it is devoid of any gay talk, but here is plenty of demon talk and final training talk.

    Meredith ends his letter with the following:

    Please, co-workers and brethren, try to totally commit yourself to the God of the Bible and to His coming Kingdom! It is very real! It is coming relatively soon—sooner than many people believe! Those of us in this Work are going “all out” to prepare the way for that coming Government. We are trying to train those people who could be literal kings and priests assisting Christ in ruling this world in His coming Kingdom. We are a “team” to help prepare the way for Christ’s return and to prepare a “people for God” who really will surrender their lives to do His will and His Work with all their hearts! May God make each one of you more willing to be an active part of that “team” and be rewarded foreverbecause you have been willing to totally commit to the genuine future and to the real Government which will soon rule this earth and the entire universe.
    With Christian love,

    Roderick C. Meredith
    This is the same old song and dance he has been writing about for decades.  The problem in 2017 is just WHO exactly is the correct group teaching the correct people to be kings, priests and future gods?  If Meredith and his crew are the only ones doing this then what happens to Dave Pack's crew who claims the same thing?  What about Gerald Flurry?  He claims he and his little band of degenerate scumbags are also training the true spiritual leaders.   How can all of that be when United Church of God and Church of God a Worldwide Association also claim the very same thing.  Is God going to pick a few from each group to make everyone happy?  Where does this leave super self-righteous Bob Thiel and his merry band of African members?

    The other thing to consider with all of these groups is that they all intend to be safely secured in the desert of Jordan as they receive their final training in Petra.  Who is the rightful heir to Petra?  Is it first come first to rule, or will they all sit around a campfire and diplomatically vote on who reigns supreme?  Will they hug each other and finally agree they are  brothers and stop their petty grandiose behaviors?  Will Bob Thiel hug Rod Meredith and apologize and say "Can't we all just be friends, Big Daddy?"

    Don't count on it!  All of these self-serving and self-appointed narcissists will never be able to give up control.  They have spent too many decades lying about themselves to everyone that they no longer have any humility left.  All any of them can do anymore is think about themselves and what new title they can dream up.  Just how many apostles, prophets, Pastor Generals, Chief Overseers, and doubly-blessed end time witnesses do we need?

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    BobThiel writes:

    Dear Dennis Diehl   

    Read your post about me this morning at the Banned by HWA website. Since I do not always go to that site nor read all that is there, I would have thought that you would have emailed me if you really wanted a discussion.

    (Hello  Bob,  Thank you for writing.  I had looked in the past on your site for a "contact me/us" button and did not find one so would not have known how to get in touch. 
    I also am in alternative health.  I have therapeutic massage practice on the Willamette just outside Portland.  Have worked for a decade with chiropractors, and others along the way such as yourself.  I live in the neighborhood where HWA lived , worked and got baptized as well as near where Richard and Ted were born. 
    Also, I suppose my public offer was because you had also taken me into the public arena on your site and the "Apostate former minister...."  label didn't help.  Just as you, I am not fond of labels and without you knowing my background and such, found my own buttons punched a bit.  Apostate would be your definition because I don't believe as you do or did not chose to continue my ministry through all the chaos and upheaval of the 90's and beyond.  Almost 30 years of daily ministry in 5 states and 14 congregations was enough.  To me, the whole WCG experience was a youthful mistake for which I will pay and pay.  I was a very compassionate, easy going and non judgmental type of minister and not beholding to the Armstrongs emotionally through those years due to my growing up Presbyterian and able to think for myself even as a WCG minister.  I'm not apostate.  I am awake.
    I know Rod Meredith, Michael Germano, Gerald Weston and Doug Winnail personally.  I went to school with Gerald Flurry (arrogant even then) and Dave Pack.
    As I believe you realize, I do NOT demand (nor want) the type of idolatrous following that David Pack and Gerald Flurry do.
    And for that you should be congratulated.  Both of those men are classic narcissists with ALL the symptoms and behaviors.  Dave is taking his delusions many steps further as he, in my view, is slidding into religious delusions that are not going to end well.  He may be classically mentally ill.  We'll see.  His church is doomed.
    While the Continuing Church of God does accept tithes and offering, unlike those men I have not asked people to sacrifice their funds or get into debt so that CCOG could construct buildings or make some massive campus.
    I agree, you have not done that at all.  Good on ya!
    Yet, on more than one occasion, you lumped me together with them--presumably knowing that I have written articles exposing their errors and positions.
    I have , as has the blog owner at Banned and most of those who go to that sight for whatever personal reasons they have.  Money, treating members badly, spending on this or that is not the issue others take you to task for or consider you like them for.
    The issue Bob is the taking of titles , out of the blue , for oneself  and the reasonings one goes to to come to such conclusions.  Flurry is Apostle and Prophet and even That Prophet which is beyond stupid.  Dave takes every ridiculous title for every ridiculous reason one can imagine.  He just makes it up.  You have declared yourself a prophet based on dreams and a "double portion" prayer during an anointing and it for that they take you to task and consider you like Flurry, Pack and Malm along with lesser knowns who also do the same thing. 
    I won't challenge you on your own impression of yourself but you have to know that to trust in a dream , dreams we all have as the mind processes the day and even our inner issues are not how we should govern our lives.  I dream every week of speaking at the feast but don't think it means I should.  They feel you simply could not get along with LCG, were not listened to, promoted or given credit for your ideas and with sour grapes walked off , made up reasons you could become a prophet and here you are, yet another sliver of the church.  That's what they consider you to be like them for.  With 700 slivers all over the world as the debris of WCG, it's an oft told tale
    The site watchers and Gary also find your presentations less than professional. If you have some funds, why not put it into making them more credible.  I watched , all I could , your "sermon" using the answers from the letter answering dept of yore.  Why bother Bob?  It makes you look like you have nothing real to say.  Those answers are way out of date and to even bother with some you addressed sets you up for ridicule. No one cares about dogs and tithing and many other nit picking topics of the past.  Much of those answers are outdated and simply out of context and merely opinions on things no one cares about. 
    No one cares about dangers of football and what would Jesus watch.  They are going to mock you for that.  (Football is dangerous but it's not a theological topic and makes you look shallow and petty)  No one in the NT fussed about gladiators or the arena down the street and probably did not because it would have been harmful to their survival for going against Rome which you'd not even know ran the show by reading the Gospels, Epistles or letters. 
    Anyway, I spare you, but if you want more credibility, at least invest a bit your setting and look professional
    You also probably realize that I do not take a salary from the Continuing Church of God. Instead, after paying for expenses related to proclaiming the gospel (mainly related to literature and videos), the bulk of our remaining funds go to Africa to reach people there as well as to support the poor, widows, and orphans.
    Excellent.  We did all that growing up in our Calvinistic Presbyterian Church.  It was what churches of my youth did.  WCG only seemed to help out if it benefited them and of course Dave believes helping anyone but himself is just wrong.
    Regarding the 6000 years, I presume you realize that I believe in a version of what is called the 'gap theory' (, hence I do not believe that I have ignored paleontology.
    Yes, and I don't believe such things.  Good science done well shows the universe to be 14.5 billion years old, earth to be 4.5 billion years old.  The issues we could discuss are not so much evolution as that is not either of our areas of expertise, but rather creationism vs science and whether Genesis is literally true or myths with other reasons for being written, which I believe.  I see , as do many, no reason to take Genesis 1-11 as anything but myth and those taken from Sumerian creation tales with a Hebrew spin.  This is not difficult to show.  I have my doubts about the literal existence of Abraham, Moses, the Exodus right up to David and Solomon with those stories including the Pentateuch being written by the established priesthood in the Babylonian captivity etc.  Long story but accepted by many to be the case.  An acquaintance , Israel Finkelstein, author of The Bible Unearthed gave me some good insights into that when digging at Megiddo of which he was in charge when I was there for a summer.  He is one of Israel's premier archaeologists.
    You have ignored actual paleontology I think but we can save that for another day.
    I imagine you'd defend creationist thinking exactly as Dave Pack did in his almost endless series where he made a fool out of himself and was called out for it on a video rebuttal by Aron Ra, who has the actual background to put such topics to rest.  If you have not seen what he did to Dave ,  you might learn from it if you have an open mind to updated scientific discover of the past 40 years.
    You'd not want Aron focusing on you and your "simple four proof against evolution"

    As far as  Dr. Neil DeGrasse Tyson goes, are you serious? In all due respect, he comes across as a zealot to push an anti-God agenda and certainly not as a scientist interested in the truth. I watched several of his television programs years ago and my recollection is that I found his 'proofs' sorely lacking.
    Are you serious?  If that's how you view men such as him with their background and training, nothing will get through to you.  You should update from "years ago" and try again.  Your own "proofs" of many things , including your gross misunderstanding of the context and meaning of Isaiah's "line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little there a little" shows you won't change in the midst of overwhelming evidence on even this small point.  It is NOT a scripture on how to study the Bible .  If you have not read the context of it , here is my take on it which reflects that of real theologians well trained. 
    Could you admit to being wrong about this?  If not, can you prove to me why you think it does mean "this is how to study scripture " in Isaiah's mind?
    I am a published scientist myself, as you can verify if you go to PubMed, the US National Institutes of Health's medical database.
    Then you should know better and while you might have a scientific background in one topic or another, you do not have a background in cosmology, paleontology or archaeology as do I not.
    , you list in your profile the Banned by HWA website. That site regularly makes false and misleading statements about me, puts out headlines about me that are not true, and lumps me in with others in a manner that is often inappropriate. It needs to cease and desist doing that.
    Why don't you write an article explaining what you find wrong and why and send it to me or Gary to print.  I am only a guest writer at Banned.  It is not my site and I don't control who ceases and desists what. 
    I would suggest that you work with the people at that site so they stop trying to mislead people about me and the Continuing Church of God. If you can do so, then perhaps a more public debate about why evolution is scientifically-flawed could make sense.

    Bob Thiel
    I'd rather address the topic of biblical errancy, myth vs literalism and New Testament origins and politic.  Would love to chat about who Paul is and was and why you can't go with Peter, James and John AND Paul.  Each hated the other and did not believe the same things about Jesus.  Galatians makes that very very clear.  I will say that Paul declared himself in the same way Flurry, Pack and others have taken their titles and ordinations to themselves.  That is not a compliment.  The Jesus of Paul was a Cosmic, Hallucinatory Christ and Paul had no use for the teachings of the Jewish Christian church under James...  Long story, never mind
    Thank you for your response . Hope this helps you to get to know me a bit.  Remember, I am not an apostate.  I am awake


    Dear Dennis:
    About a 1/2 hour after I sent my email to you, I saw you posted against me again, etc.

    *(I posted nothing so not sure what Bob was referring too and it went unexplained.)

    I am sorry that you seem to believe that you are beyond "the faith once for all delivered to the saints" (Jude 3).
    As far as many of the matters you brought up, I would refer you to as there are articles on many of those topics.
    But I will state that dreams consistent with scripture, that are later confirmed (and this includes dreams of others), combined with prayer being answered, is different than simply having random dreams.
    As far as presentations go, Moses, Jeremiah, and Paul were not good that way. I try, but recognize that I have limits. God does not always work through the most entertaining presenters.
    Bob Thiel

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    Stephen Carl Allwine of Minnesota has been charged with killing his wife.


    It's got everything. Staged suicides. Attempts at hiring a hitman. Extramarital affairs. 

    The Alwine family is currently in the COG (UCG last I checked).

    Church members in UCG and COGWA who knew them were shocked when the story of Amy's murder first came to light. 

    Stephen Alwine had staged the "discovery" of his wife's body with his 9-year-old son, and church members first believed their family had been a terrible victim of outsiders. They didn't want to believe that this could happen to church members (it does) and were quick to blame it on the nearest black/gay/atheist/muslim home invader. 

    Of course, as every police procedural will tell you, the spouse is always the first suspect.

    The local COG congregations, needless to say, are completely floored.

    ht: Silenced


    Daily Mail UK news had this about the UCG link:

    Husband is charged with shooting dead his wife then trying to disguise her death as a suicide by staging her body with a handgun 'after failed murder-for-hire plots paid for with bitcoins on Dark Web' 
    According to his LinkedIn page, Stephen Allwine works as an IT specialist at an insurance company and has long been active in ministry at the United Church of God.
    His late wife was the owner of Active Dogs Sports Training located next door to the family’s home, which went out of business a short time after her death. 


    KARE Minneapolis
    A criminal complaint filed in Washington County details how Stephen Carl Allwine, 43, 
    allegedly shot his wife, Amy, in the head after engaging in several affairs 
    and trying to contact a hit man on the 'dark web' to kill her.

    When Cottage Grove police were summoned to an alleged suicide on a Sunday evening in November, it didn’t take long for them to figure out something was amiss.
    The victim, Amy Louise Allwine, lay dead on the bedroom floor at her home on 110th Street S. Beside her left elbow was a 9mm handgun, opposite from where the bullet entered the right-handed victim’s head.
    “Victim’s hands revealed no soot, no gunpowder stippling, no unburned gunpowder stippling, and no blood on either hand,” according to a criminal complaint filed Wednesday that charges her husband, Stephen Carl Allwine, 43, with second-degree murder.

    Investigators also uncovered evidence that he wanted out of his marriage. He was having at least two extramarital affairs with metro-area women, arranged through the Ashley Madison website. 

    Several law enforcement agencies were involved in the investigation, including Cottage Grove and Woodbury police, the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension and other state and federal agencies, said Capt. Peter Koerner of Cottage Grove police. 
    “I’ve never seen a case this complicated,” said Fred Fink, who manages the criminal division for the Washington County attorney’s office. “Most of the time we’re dealing with human witnesses, but this one required a significant amount of electronic and scientific evidence.” 
    Stephen Allwine, arrested Tuesday, remains in the Washington County jail.
    Bail was set Wednesday at $1 million with no conditions or $500,000 that would require GPS monitoring, no travel outside Minnesota, and no unsupervised visits with the couple’s 9-year-old son. 
    Allwine’s next court appearance is scheduled for Feb. 13.

    Murder charges: Cottage Grove man staged wife's suicide after searching for hitman on 'Dark Web'

    Cottage Grove man charged with wife's murder

    Daily Mail UK article


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    Various news sources have published stories about the combining of human cells with pig cells to grow human organs in other animals for human transplant.  The Almost Arrested False prophet and illegitimate self appointed COG leader sees it as a sure sign that the world is coming to an end.  He has preached several times about man pigs taking over the world while ignoring Jesus and what he taught and what he accomplished and abolished.  New Covenant be damned, man pigs rule!  Does he really think any of his African followers care about such silly topics?  His three or four American members might since they feel the world is quickly about to crash into oblivion. His African members care more about living life free from hunger, terrorism, tribal fighting and slavery to Muslims.  They find solace and comfort in the stories of the scriptures and could care less about the endless troves of silly topics Habakkuk Thiel preaches about each week.  Do they care about football and rampaging man pigs running around the earth? That does not bother the false prophet though.

    He is now incensed that he is being mocked.  The sensitive man/boy is stomping his feet in Arroyo Grande tonight.  He is livid I tell you!  Livid!  I can hear the steam whistling out of his ears all the way  down here in Rancho Santa Fe!

    I warned about this in prior years as well as earlier this month.  I even made a sermonette video about this nearly three weeks ago: Half human, half pig: What’s the difference?
    After I did this, the anti-Church of God website, Banned by HWA, posted the following, including vulgarities, about me:

    Do 21st Century Christians Need To Worry About Man-Pigs? COG Prophet Thinks So!

    I never cease to be amazed at the weirdness that continues to leak out of the minds of foolish Church of God leaders. …
    Now we have our very own Doubly Blessed buffoon preaching a sermon about “man-pigs.” Yes, that is right.  Almost arrested, Elisha, Elijah, Amos Joshua, Habakkuk Bob Thiel felt the need to preach a sermon about “man-pigs and humanzee’s.” …
    Thiel adds the title “Dr.” to  the front of his name he looks like a complete blithering idiot.  No “Dr.” in his right mind nor real theologian would ever preach such utter bullshit in a sermon.  This kind of idiocy is what occupies the mind of those that cannot and will not acknowledge Jesus.  The idiots are embarrassed to preach any thing that has to do with Jesus.
    Just because the liar and certified false prophet waves his big thick Bible at the beginning of his video does not make himself an authority on the book he waves.
    Maybe his 1,997 members in Africa might find his sermon slightly interesting due to the fact so many are still steeped in tribal myths and legends, but no Christian today has this topic occupying their mind.

    Apparently the false prophet does not like having his sermons referred to as bullshit.   Sensitive little ears and self-righteous minds can't handle the truth.

    The self-appointed false prophet and teacher then writes:
    Are Christian leaders supposed to keep quiet about the sins of the end-time descendants of Israel?
    According to some anti-Church of God critics, apparently so.
    But you are not a real Christian Bob.  You are one in name only, a so-called Christian, unlike the real Christians around the world you deem less than worthy due to your high, dreamy,  doubly-blessed, status with your god. Plus worshipping the law while ignoring that inconvenient dude you pretend to follow and preaching worthless sermons about silly topics does not make you a Christian.  Waving your big thick bible does not make you a follower of God.

    The fact still remains, you really do need to keep quiet!

    Even worse in Thiel's eyes is that he was accused of copying Living Church of God's article about man pigs that it had published before Thiel had his hysterics.
    Chimeras are an abomination! I have personally been warning/crying out against chimeras for years.
    Yet, notice one of the ill-informed mockers at the Banned by HWA site posted the following comment about me:
    Bob is just a copycat:
    LCG was already preaching about Bob’s topic many months ago. A true prophet would have been crying aloud and sparing not about this vital topic long before the lukewarm LCG preachers were warning us about it.
    January 15, 2017 at 8:19 AM
    Claiming I just did this months after LCG did, to copy LCG on that, is absurd. Not only do I not recall ever seeing the LCG item, I have warned against chimeras for years. Need proof? See February 7, 2014 post: Russia looking at total GMO food ban; the frightening chimera research, as well as my article Chimeras: Has Science Crossed the Line?I also specifically warned against pig-human chimeras in 2015 (see Pig-Human GMOs proposed).
    False prophet Thiel's priorities are seriously distorted.  That is apparent in his highlight comment above.

    The fact still remains, he really does need to keep quiet!

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    From Exit and Support:

    PCG Should Be Investigated:
    January 28, 2017
    The letter concerning Mark Saranga and his daughter Alicia breaks my heart. What a cruel and ruthless thing to do. I am reminded of what Jesus preached about the prodigal son and how he treated the lady at the well, and many of the other wonderful things He did for sinners. Flurry claims to preach the gospel to the world. What gospel? One of destroying the family? There is certainly no love, grace and truth in what he and his ministers preach. By not preaching the true gospel the PCG is twice cursed according to the Apostle Paul.
    Now that Obama and Clinton have been taken care of and the USA has a Christian and Jewish supporting President, we who are suffering under the PCG rules should contact our new president and request him to have this so called "church" investigated for breaking any law on child care and have the IRS do a financial audit on them. I cannot remember when last we saw audited accounts from the PCG or any of their branches around the world.
    I remember many years ago that the FBI were very interested in H Armstrong and the WCG. --W.
    FBI Files on Herbert Armstrong: 
    March 29, 2006 
    I once met with and talked with Anthony Buzzard. I find that his connections (mentioned in the report you link to) are v6ery interesting. I marked some in red for quick perusal. I used to talk to Gene Bailey and I was the one that told him about the files on the WWCG with the FBI, etc. He later tried to obtain them, but they were blacked out and the information hidden. However, I obtained and viewed the files from the early 1970s that weren't blacked out. I had written the Un-American Activities Commission in 1972 and received information that HWA and WWCG were under surveillance and suspected of UnAmerican activities. I also received a letter from the Congressional Library.  
    This all documents the connections between the evil powers of the underworld and the WWCG. --Former WCG member [name withheld] 
    Comment: The report being referred to is The Conspiracy Was Strong - The Discernment Ministries. Herbert W. Armstrong and Anthony Buzzard and their connections are mentioned in Parts 1-3. (Just search for the words "Worldwide Church of God" in Pt. I.) The FBI files on Herbert Armstrong and Stanley Rader are mentioned. Anthony Buzzard was formerly a lecturer at Ambassador College in Bricket Wood, England. The Ambassador Report #48, May 1991, has a section entitled, "The FBI's Files on the WCG." Ambassador Report #51, October 1992, followed up by saying these files were later released to Gene Bailey but with much blacked out. It is alleged that many groups known as "cults" have a hidden agenda and work together to create a passive people. (Read this part in the Rules of Disinformation which talks about the CIA being involved in Waco and Jonestown.) They have similar methods of deception and abuse are often fronts for intelligence activity. Read more about this and WCG / HWA activities from OIU Newsletter #6, pt. 3
    The article about the FBI interest is here:  The Conspiracy Was Strong 

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    Mark Saranga Kicks Daughter Out of House:
    January 25, 2017 
    Mark Saranga took over as head of the PCG Mail Processing Dept. when Mark Nash was unceremoniously fired from that position. His daughter Alicia was seeing a "worldly" boy at the public school she attended, so Mark Saranga kicked her out of the house never to return (which is in keeping with Gerald Flurry's disfellowshipping policy). Alicia was a minor and around 16 years old at the time. She had no place to go as the other PCG members were too afraid of Gerald Flurry putting them out, too, for sheltering someone thrown out of the PCG. People are in fear of the ministry. 
    Alicia had to go to the local office of Health and Human Services and tell them she was basically homeless without any means of support. The State put her into foster care and she has been there ever since. Her father Mark Saranga is still an "upstanding minister" in the PCG. He writes for the Philadelphia Trumpet and Royal Vision magazine and his work is predominantly featured on the PCG website. Ironically, one of his current articles on there is about the Sandy Hook tragedy and how to protect your children. This coming from a man who kicked out his minor aged daughter to the curb for seeing a boy in school. 
    Not only are Gerald Flurry's insane policies destroying the PCG financially, but they are also causing a local strain on the taxpayers as the kicked out minor aged children of the PCG members are relying on the State to survive. --[name withheld]

    This is not the fruit incident of PCG ministers forcing their kids out into the streets. It has been regular occurrence in PCG over the decades, though usually it is the ministry forcing members to kick their kids out.

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    Forget the Two Tree'a.  It is all about Dave's trees now.

    We should have all known there was great significance in Dave Packs recent fascination with trees.  Being the strong vocal man the he is, he has been boasting how he has been ripping and running trees on his cult compounding Wadsworth, Ohio.

    Here is what he has to say about Jesus coming to his Kingdom on earth.  It will NOT be in Zion or Jerusalem.

    Another proof: This is a fascinating thing, go to the end of the Bible, I’m going to read you a stunningstunning verse. All of you around the world—BELIEVE your Bibles I could load you with information I’ve learned, but I have to move fast…Let’s read Revelation 22. Now, in verse 12, Christ said…
    “Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be…[You now know that is to set up the Kingdom. Let’s read a little bit more about it.]…I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last” (Rev. 22:12-13).
    We all know that the Church, in many ways, Christ has always said, is a city set on a hill that cannot be hid. I’ve always viewed the campus this way. Mr. Armstrong thought of it that way with every campus.
    “Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city” (vs. 14). Now what does that mean?
    It cannot be New Jerusalem and it cannot be Zion. Why? Why is it some other, smaller city? Well first of all, the context is He just came, so He isn’t coming to Zion and He’s not coming for 1,000 years to Jerusalem. Here is the reason—the next verse…There is a little, tiny city where, outside it, are dogs, sorcerers, whoremongers, murderers, idolaters, and liars. It is impossible…It’s impossible, people of God, that that is New Jerusalem and the 1,000 years. This is the first period I want to eliminate. There will be no dogs, no false prophets…That is what it means…No liars, no sorcerers…The devil’s bound. There will be no whoremongers, no murderers—that’s impossible.
    …We all know—there are no unconverted people on Earth at the start of the Millennium. It cannot be talking about New Jerusalem. It’s a little, tiny city with gates—meaning there are walls—and that is because some can come in and most cannot. But right outside…and everywhere else…still have false ministers, idol worshippers, murderers, whoremongers, liars galore…but not inside this little city.
    Now, why couldn’t it be Jerusalem, after we have gone to Zion? Same reason. Go read II Peter 3. I think about verse 10, when He says the new heavens and new earth comes—He says wherein dwells righteousness (II Peter. 3:13). Christ has set up His Kingdom in Zion. It isn’t going to be right outside Zion there are all those terrible things. We read, at the end of Zechariah, there are no false prophets, there are no idols, the devil is gone; there can’t be sorcerers. Christ is going to deal with the whoremongers and everybody else. It cannot be Zion. It cannot be New Jerusalem. It is this little cityright hereIt has to be. There are no other possibilities.
    There are only three options; two of them are impossibilities. What’s important—and this is proof—there is space. Apparently, Joshua is told—you keep My courts. He has some kind of authority and power. Trespassers, drunks, vandals, criminals, unbelievers…others…cannot come in to this place. Now, if they come into the Church, then maybe they can. But there are gates…this is a gate that won’t let dogs in—false ministers are not coming on to this campus.
    Now why is that a Kingdom? You have to have tremendous sovereign authority…Or anybody could enter through those gates. Only those that do the commandments do. Why? Apparently—and you ought to make note of this—the tree of life is here. Is there any doubt this is the Kingdom of God? That’s what it says. I know it’s in Zion; I know it’s in New Jerusalem, but the description of verse 15does not fit…
    “I Jesus have sent my angel to testify unto you these things in the churches” (22:16). “Angel” there means “messenger.” At the end of the age, a messenger—there is no angel telling anybody any of this. I’m sure we all know that. The word is “messenger.”
    “I have sent my messenger to testify unto you these things in the churches…[I am doing that, and I am going to do it outside the walls of Restored, so to speak. There are no walls today, but you know what I mean—beyond the shores of Restored. I know who I am and what I’m supposed to do. I understand the restitution of all things comes in two phases and an announcement of it, so that God’s people know they are looking for a grain of sand and not a tremendous, earth-shaking event that lasts 1,000 years. So I am doing my part. Who said this?]…the root and the offspring the David, the bright and morning star” (vs. 16). That is happening now.
    Now a little point. I will quickly describe it…Zechariah 5verses 1 to 4. This sounds much more like a time the Kingdom of God is in place…where this curse goes out all over the world. It’s a unique curse. It’s just described, in chapter 3, Joshua, and then chapter 4, Zerubbabel and the Two Witnesses. Immediately, God says…after these men are introduced on to the scene and others, of course, with them…that a unique curse goes out over all the earth, Zechariah 5:1 to 4, where if you steal, or you swear falsely in the name of God, who has set up His Kingdom, you will be sealed into your house and you will be dissolved along with the wood and stone that built the house.
    Why would you need to do that, in many ways, if there is compliance all over the world? Here’s why? In a world filled with scam artists, thievesliars, people who speak in the name of God because there are dogs, meaning false ministers…In the New Testament, we all understand that’s what “dogs” means. We’re not talking about German Shepherds or Chihuahuas. It’s talking about false ministers. They will be out there. God’s Kingdom is on Earth—they are going to see tremendous opportunity, because scam artists will scam anybody about anything at any time, if they can get a nickel out of it.
    God says, in effect, you will not use My government or My name or My Kingdom and pretend to represent it. I will have angels seal you into your house, and I will dissolve you like battery acid fell over you—and your house will be gone, too. Go look at Zechariah 5:1 to 4, and it actually tells you that something different has happened when the men and all the thousands who are with them in chapters 3 and 4 are established, and grace comes out of Zerubbabel’s mouth to the world. Because Mr. Armstrong’s function, I truly do believe—from Day One in the Kingdom—will be about the Kingdom.
    Elijah will work with the Church…He will work with the Kingdom, initially. Elijah’s job is to work with Israel and Judah. Zerubbabel’s job appears to be to manage matters of the Kingdom—from Day One—when the Kingdom starts. That’s why I am certain of it. I’ve explained this. Is he the Chief Administrator? Elijah’s function is different. The men of wonder have a different function. I think that is one of the biggest proofs something dramatically different has happened.
    Next one: Zechariah 11verse 10…Turn over there. Now this…This is an interesting thing. This is proof that the Kingdom came……
    “And [so] it was broken in that day: and so the poor of the flock that waited upon me knew that it was the word of the LORD” (vs. 11).
    Here is what the word of the LORD is: They know that the Kingdom of God has come to Earth, and God has changed everything with all peoples on the face of the earth. Grace is snapped, and now it is God fulfilling Jeremiah 31, and He is writing His Law in people’s hearts anywhere anyone in the world. Anywhere that anyone in the world wants to respond to the Kingdom of God and receive all the blessings and benefits and bounty, as I like to put it, of that Kingdom, they can now do it—and until Christ comes—that is not possible. So it’s a whole new world, starting, of course, with setting up the government to do that……
    For now, note that Christ is coming to address trees, with a couple of kinds, here, being described as “reduced” and a couple others “increased” in the same way. You can probably guess the connection, by now, to trees; but there are many verses…I could tell you, right now, nine different places, Old Testament and New, where Christ is very interested in trees, which are leaders. There is a big connection here, but I’ll just leave it for that, until we can get into a list of nine to a dozen verses where Christ is going to work with leaders—ministers—who He describes as trees.

    Superfantabulous Dave, new stand in awe.

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    Poor Dave.  He just does not get it.  How can any real COG member ever ignore his preaching?  Church of God News is reporting how befuddle Pack is over the fact hat hardly anyone followed him out of Akron when he got fired, yet followed the next minister into United and then ultimately taking more into COGWA.  How can people ignore the most significant man on earth?

    David Pack, of the Restored Church of God, stated, in his sermon on Dec. 31st:
    “I remember when I was fired (by the Worldwide Church of God in 1993), right here in Akron, and there were 38 people came with us. That’s the number.
    Two years later, another guy was fired, who had bought into and taught the trinity. I had his sermon ... The TRINITY -  and 200 people followed him. He went on to be the President of United. Now he’s a top minister in COGwa.
    Two hundred people followed him. Didn’t any of them remember, right there in the room, I told them where it was going, and they follow a guy that taught them the trinity? And these were ‘escapees’, you see? ...
    I listened. I mean, the whole thing - eyeballs and elbows - taught it all; swallowed hook, line and sinker - and they followed him 
    (to a newly formed church - the United Church of God), because they said, “Well, it’s just the nature of God. We’re not really changing anything.”

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    I just don't see it that way.
    Ok...I don't see it at all.

    I gave a sermon once with a large 3D image that , when looked at properly and with parallel viewing skills  (go learn ye what that meaneth) one would see the hidden picture embedded in the pattern.

    The point was, of course, just how difficult it can be at times to see that which is clearly there if we just know how to do it.  Once you could see the image, you could never unsee it.  If you could not see it, try as you might or would not see it because one believes it's not there to see,  you never saw it.

    Small Candy Clusters

    After the sermon the large image placed on an easel was available up close and a rather large crowd of people gathered around it. I stood back and listened.

    "How's this thing supposed to work?"
    (Didn't listen to the sermon)

    "Looks like just a bunch of jumble to me"
    (Flippant know it all who states the momentary obvious and isn't about to try to see anything differently or ask how to"

    "Oh I see it!!!"
    (That was fast!)

    "Ok, kinda gotta just relax your eyes and cross them a bit."
    (Apt to teach)

    "You're nuts!"
    (Their common response to everything not understood or provides no interest)

    "I think I see it."
    (Eventually did)

    "I think I see it"
    (Wanted to but I doubt ever did)

    "Yeah I see it it. So what"
    (Maybe saw it. Maybe not. Can't admit to learning anything they didn't come up with or not actually seeing it, who cares.)


    "This is stupid"
    (That's as far as they got)

    "Oh , oh....that is so cool!"
    (Went about teaching others how to see it too)

    "Um...oh yeah, I see it" 
    (leaves and didn't really)

    "I didn't come to church for this crap"
    (I went back to church crap the next week)

    "Sorry, I don't see it. I gotta go."
    (I think they wanted to but it just didn't work for them)

    "Yeah, yeah...I saw it. Let's go to lunch"
    (Didn't see it. Didn't want to admit they couldn't see. Changed the topic)

    "Diehl is an idiot. I want our old minister back"
    (Change is uncomfortable. Long for the past and attack the messenger)

    "C'mon! Let's go to lunch!"
    (More hungry than inquisitive. Or just can't see it and gave up)

    (Just kidding...  Dave Pack sermon in 2D.  Nothing here to see no matter how long you sit and hope to see it)

    Old or Young?
    It depends on how you look at it...

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    The craziness continues to flow out of Wadsworth through the lips of one of Armstrongism's most narcissistic false prophets ever.  Even false teacher Bob Thiel pales in comparison.

    Pack believes that the Man of Sin will arise out of a Church of God, along with two assistants who will deceive the whole world.  This man might even be miraculously healed of a major sickness, but will not be a man resurrected from the grave.

    Tens of thousands of COG members will wisely refuse to follow this deceitful little man and will immediately recognize that Dave Pack is the true shining light on the hill. They will flow into the Restored Church of God binging their money with them.

    II Thessalonians 3verse 6: “Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw yourselves from every brother that walks disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.”
    Those in the splinters…There are thousands of them, brethren, who are in the splinters, who have the Holy Spirit. They’re not going to follow this man, and they’re the ones that are going to come back to God’s Church. I’ll have a lot more to say about them, in a way that will simply stun you—stunyou. They’re going to escape, but not until they go through fire.
    I don’t know how long this man will last, but we ought to, at least, pause and say…The next thing we’re looking for is not Christ revealed from heaven. It’s this evil blasphemer…revealed out of the splinters—that is coming first, and God is going to vacuum away all the tares and those who lost His Spirit and who will not come—and they’re not going to come later—they’re out. You know Luke 14. There are those who are invited and they don’t come. God said they were not going to come…They will in no wise enter this supper……
    Let’s be clear…(II Thessalonians 2verse 12, those who follow him are damned. They are condemned. I didn’t say that. God does. Why? Because they “believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.” You cannot be saved if you follow a Satan-possessed, blaspheming, false Christ. Who knows? Maybe he says he’s God the Father. There’s a guy in Rome that calls himself the Holy Father. It’s not shocking that a human being might say that.
    Salvation is lost to the people who follow this man…It just was never clear how far they would go, and how God would vacuum them out of the Church. God said in Haggai—I called for the desolation. I raise up the Foolish Shepherd. It’s something He’s doing. He hardened pharaoh. He used Judas. He can do that. He can use man for a righteous purpose like Cyrus, and others.

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  • 01/30/17--13:07: Hot Rod Church of God

  • New Living Church of God Splinter Group Forming!

    Here's the just finished logo for a soon-coming LCG splinter after RCM's demise. It's core doctrines will be everything RCM ever said or did, including wife spanking, gay bashing, sermons on sexual perversions, boxing, and wildly speculative prophecy. All members will share the honorary title of Third Most Important Person in the Work.

    That is not a cross you see. It is a sword.

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    Anonymous said...
    The fairy tales aren't really fairy tales.
    Since I won't be there when they are about to throw you into the lake of fire, I'II say it now. I told you so. I repeat, I told you so.

    Another Anonymous said:
    Dennis Diehl; Well one thing for sure Dennis, you know what wasting time on a fairytale is all about, and listening to others like Aron Ra who believes in the same fairytale, and you talk talk about others wasting their life, either way Dennis, we will all find out who wasted what in the long run. If there is no God or if the bible isn't true then it really doesn't matter if I wasted my time believing it, on the other hand, what if God and Jesus and the bible turns out to actually be real, that means I didn't waste my time at all, now where that leaves you, I don't know.

    • Pas·cal's wa·ger
      1. the argument that it is in one's own best interest to behave as if God exists, since the possibility of eternal punishment in hell outweighs any advantage of believing otherwise.

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    The improperly named "continuing" Church of God is making the claim that one of its ministers in Africa was able to call rain down from heaven recently.  Almost arrested Elisha, Elijah, Amos, Joshua, Habakuk, prophet Bob Thiel is making that claim.

    Miracle rain in Kenya
    Pastor Dr Bob
    Greetings from Kenya.
    Today Alexander was praying for the rain in Kenya. After ten minutes the rain came from nowhere and rain. This is the miracle we seen when we are in Narok. He was feeling very bad when he saw how people were suffering in Kitengela Nairobi simply because of water. His prayer is answered. …
     The self-appointed false propeht makes this claim:
    Notice also the following:
    17 Elijah was a man with a nature like ours, and he prayed earnestly that it would not rain; and it did not rain on the land for three years and six months. 18 And he prayed again, and the heaven gave rain, and the earth produced its fruit. (James 5:17-18) 
    So the Bible clearly shows that prayer can affect the weather–and it just did in Kenya.
    Dave Pack has been proclaiming that mass healings and mass conversions will happening in his church, but instead Elisha Thiel's personality cult is experiencing "healing" and mass conversions instead.

    When we wanted to close, one old man stood up and testify that one of his ears had been bad and did not hear anything but when I was preaching, he testify that all his ears we opened miraculously. 
    I also met a Sunday pastor there who told me that I have to visit him in his place. So when I went, he took me to his meeting hall where I met all members. I met a total of 94 people and when I taught them about Sabbath and baptism, all of them turned their heart to keep Sabbath. And now they are Sabbathkeepers. One old lady insisted that I must baptize her tomorrow. … So tomorrow I will conduct baptism in MALAWI.
    Mass conversions in the improperly named "continuing"Church of God?  

    Apostle Thiel then claims though his personality cult, the deaf can now hear,and the spiritually blind can now see.
    So consider that we had the deaf who hear, the gospel being preached, and the spiritually blind who can now see (cf. Luke 7:22)!
    It looks like God may have performed a miracle then, not only heal the man who could not hear, but to also get the Sunday pastor’s attention. 
    God is working and thankfully some can see that.

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    What would the Church of God movement be without ANOTHER college or school?  After Herbert Armstrong started three different colleges, all of the bigger COG splinter groups feel that they need to do the same thing.  UCG has its Ambassador Bible College.  COGWA has its Foundations Instiute, Center for Biblical Studies. Living Church of God has Living University.  Philadelphia Church of God has its Herbert W Armstrong College.  Dave Pack has sadly missed that band wagon, at least so far, due to his dramatic drop in income. Various other splinter groups also have small "bible based" courses, and the vast majority still have links up to the old Ambassador College Correspondence Course.

    Now we have another self appointed man who feels his wisdom surpasses all other COG members, thus he feels the need to educate as many as possible to become his followers.  This man knows more about the Bible than any other COG leader ever has in human history.  And no, it is NOT Bob Thiel. Thiel has been left whimpering in the shadows of his home office due to the miraculous knowledge this end time witness and prophet has.  This miraculous man is James Malm!  Malm and his Wiccan sidekick Constance have now ventured out into a new "school."

    Welcome to the Shining Light School of Biblical Studies!  Aren't you excited?????  Can't you just feel the ZEAL!!!!!!  Malm and Constance now have set themselves up as the end-all in biblical knowledge.  There are no other people on this earth who are as righteous and filled with zeal as these two are.  It is no wonder Thiel is whimpering in the corner of his study.  No man on this earth has such an inside track into the mind of the Old Testament God than James Malm, who has elevated the law to a higher position than Jesus had ever imagined his own self attaining.

    Where would the Church of God be without all of these prophets, teachers, and end time guru's leading the church astray?  Eighty years of Armstrongism and this is what we end up with...Malm, Pack, Thiel, Flurry, Kubik and Meredith.  Who would ever have imagined!

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    For decades we heard COG leaders proclaim, "We are family!" Yet has there ever been a church that treated its member with as much disdain, at times, as has the Church of God?  Never has there been a group of people who has been constantly beaten down as "unworthy" because "they just don't get it," or have so disappointed Jesus Christ that he has had to delay his second coming for 80 some years.  Thousands of articles and member letters have been written berating the brethren as worthless pond scum lower than the worms in the field.

    Many ministers and evangelists used members as their own personal slaves, yet never deeming them worthy enough to invite them into their own homes.  Through it all members were supposed to love one another, "as Christ loved the church." That love usually stopped the second you dared to question a minister or the church leadership, or God forbade something from the Bible.

    How could members "love" one another and care for one another when its own leaders held everyone in such contempt?  That love was never genuine and was usually the end result of fear mongering. Intense persecution, concentration camps, parents eating their children, and more gore awaited the brethren around every corner they turned.  Satan was aways on the attack.

    A Church leader gets caught in adultery...Satan is attacking the church.  A church leader gets sent to prison...Satan is attacking the church.  People refuse to acknowledge self-appointed dreamy false prophets...Satan is deceiving the brethren.  Tens of thousands refuse to jump church fellowships to join a delusional narcissist...Satan is deceiving the brethren.  God has been turned into a impotent cowering old dude sitting in the northern heavens while Satan has free reign.  Satan is even more powerful that Jesus, at least in the COG's eyes.

    Times are rough in COG land as Satan is preparing to wreck havoc with Brexit and Trump. At least in the eyes of Rod Meredith.  Now it is even more important than ever for church members to love one another.  Soon there will be intense persecution, famine and death.

    In his latest member letter to the ever growing disenchanted LCG membership, he warns of this very thing.  Fear and persecution start ripping the world apart in the very first couple of paragraphs.  Terrible times are ahead as the LCG membership will be divided by battling factions within the church and with outside splinter cult leaders like Bob Thiel and Dave Pack seeking to con as many members as they can to their dark sides.

    We Must Become Family!

    Many of us realize that. God’s people will be tried and tested as we never have been before. We will be persecuted as never before in the years ahead—as God’s Word clearly predicts. Satan will try to “divide and conquer,” as is his usual tactic. He will not only try to divide different nations and ethnic groups, but he will surely go after Christ’s true Church and try to confuse, undermine and divide us in any way he can. Yet in the terrible times just ahead, we will all need the love and support of one another more than ever. We will need to become “family” more than ever, and I hope that all of us can fully realize that and pray that God can help us respond and become a true family under the leadership of Jesus Christ. God is reproducing Himself and enlarging His Family to ultimately include billions of human beings made in His image. 
    I wonder if church member are getting sick of this "god is reproducing himself" nonsense after all these decades?  Making such a claim totally invalidates anything Jesus ever meant or anything do with the new covenant.  Anyway, back to the big powerful bogey man, the all powerful Satan, as he persecutes the chosen ones.
    But right now, as religious persecution and harassment are going to increase, we will “need each other” more than ever. We will need a “safe place” to give us the help and human support that is so encouraging—certainly in addition to direct guidance and help from God Himself. Some of our brethren may lose their jobs or lose their homes. Some may even go hungry in the years ahead, as national upheavals become worse and worse in the various parts of the world, and some will go hungry even among God’s people. So we are held accountable by our Father in heaven, who will expect us to respond with love and show a “family” spirit in the way we interact with one another.
    Can church leaders truly ever have a "safe space" in the church? With all the back stabbing, gossiping and lying members who run to the ministry every time some people wipe their noses, can here every be a true "safe space?"  It certainly will NOT be Petra.  If they treat each other like crap now, just imagine the hell it will be when everyone is isolated for 3 1/2 years in a sweltering desert as hundreds of "doubly blessed self-appointed" leaders fight over who  is in control.  Then the winning team will hold all other church leaders and members at a lower level than their frozen chosen.

    Will self appointed ministers in the church start showing love in the way they treat members?  Don't count on it. The COG track record proves otherwise.

    Meredith goes on to quote Paul and then makes the following bizarre comment:
    So even though we certainly continue to use separate bathrooms as male and female—and there are, and should be, certain differences in purely physical matters—we are one family in God, who is our Father, and we are to let this spiritual relationship override physical differences as much as we possibly can within God’s Law and God’s teachings!

    Apparently intense persecution will be coming when men and women can't use separate bathrooms, or something.

    Meredith then quotes Matthew 26 and adds this:
    Notice that Jesus Christ powerfully instructs us, as His servants, to feed the hungry, take in strangers, nurture the sick, visit those in prison and help those “in trouble” in every way we can. He tells those doubters who try to water down what He was saying, “Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it toMe” (v. 40). When you take in brethren or any human being in this kind of circumstance, you are taking in and helping Jesus Christ Himself! We all need to meditate on this and try to “do better” in the way we help and serve one another. Brethren, pray fervently about this and ask God to help us to demonstrate—in every way we can—a more complete “family spirit” in the way we interact with each other and treat one another.

    Will Rod Meredith, Gerald Weston, Richard Ames and others start taking in aimless to feed them and care for them? Will they welcome with open arms the prostitute down on that lonely Charlotte street corner or the gay, lesbian, transgendered teen recently kicked out of their home?  Will church members cook food, feed them and give them warm beds to sleep in?  Don't count on it. The answer is a BOLD NO!
    Dear brethren, let us all try to develop an even greater sense of love, warmth and enthusiasm, and a total outflowing and “giving” spirit in the way we interact with another. This will not be easy. Do not “kid” yourself. Our natural tendency is to be selfish and to take care of “self” first and others last.
    Let us “take action” now! For the times of trials and tests are coming upon us within the next few years. Again, we will “need” each other. We will “need” to have the help, the warmth, the encouragement and the physical necessities that we can share with each other in time to come. Let us not fail to serve Jesus Christ Himself, as He is present in each one of these situations. As Jesus said, “Inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me” (Matthew 25:40). 
    Since the church does not follow Christ it is going to be a hard them for them to emulate "Christ like" love.

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    It seems that some LCG members have gotten lazy during these horrific end times.  Some do not even bother to come to church any more and just stay home a stream the sermons.  Oh the horrors!!!!!!

    LCG also knows that some of their sermons can have damaging results upon the church if they are released out into the "world." We saw what happened with a sermon by Rod Meredith the sent Terry Ratzmann off the deep end and murder LCG members during a church service.

    LCG members are streaming sermons regularly and sharing passwords to friends so that they too can enjoy the sermons.  Not for much longer though.  Word has come down from on high to STOP doing this.  Lazy Laodiceans!

    We are happy to see that more and more pastors are using technology to stay connected to their congregations. The Internet can be a powerful way to do that, especially as many brethren are geographically spread out and the pastor can’t be in the same congregation every week. With that in mind, we ask you, brethren, please do not share passwords outside of your area. Your pastor’s sermons are prepared and designed with your local congregation in mind—not for brethren across the country or around the world. 
     From experience, we have seen that some brethren stay at home instead of going to services if they can watch a streamed service from another congregation. Church services are a commanded assembly, where we are not only attending to learn, but also to “stir up love and good works… exhorting one another” (Hebrews 10:24-25).  God’s word warns us that as the end draws near, we should not forsake “the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some” (verse 25).  With that in mind, please make every effort to attend when you can (of course, stay home if you are sick!).  And when you do view or listen to your pastor’s messages from home, please do not share the password outside your pastor’s area.

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    As Jesus was naming all of the dinosaurs,
    he realized that they all lived worldwide and thought,
    "Hey, this would be a good name to call my church.
    And thus he did, he named it "Worldwide" Church of God."

    Jesus was one busy dude, though I guess he has had time over the last 80 some years to name Herbert Armstrong's church The Worldwide Church of God.  After all, having his second coming delayed because of church members "just not getting it," he has had some time to do some extracurricular activities.

    The Kitchen clan writes on Facebook:
    "Under God's apostle, the true Church of God was named "Worldwide Church of God". 
    The bona-fide unincorporated spiritual organism not the California Corporation.
    The Worldwide Church of God had nothing to do with the atrocities of those who no longer were members of God's true Church! i.e from people like Joe Tkach and those who went on to create "Grace Communion International" and other organizations and corporations.
    But what Satan has done, is he has stapled those atrocities on the name "Worldwide", in order to cause people to reject that name, and to make it easier to accept "another name". It's a true slander coming from the father of lies. 
    In Revelation 3:8, we read that God's true Church does not deny the name that belongs to Christ! The name "Worldwide Church of God" did not and does not belong to ex-members or ex-ministers, or false ministers or false brethren. It was given, through inspiration of the Holy Spirit, from Jesus Christ. It is the name Jesus Christ gave to His Church, the spiritual body of Christ, through His apostle!
    The Worldwide Church of God had nothing to do with the atrocities of those who no longer were members of God's true Church! i.e from people like Joe Tkach and those who went on to create "Grace Communion International" and other organizations and corporations.
    But what Satan has done, is he has stapled those atrocities on the name "Worldwide", in order to cause people to reject that name, and to make it easier to accept "another name". It's a true slander coming from the father of lies.
    In Revelation 3:8, we read that God's true Church does not deny the name that belongs to Christ! The name "Worldwide Church of God" did not and does not belong to ex-members or ex-ministers, or false ministers or false brethren. It was given, through inspiration of the Holy Spirit, from Jesus Christ. It is the name Jesus Christ gave to His Church, the spiritual body of Christ, through His apostle!
    Jesus Christ commends His People for not denying it! So what does that mean? It means a great deal of people have denied it!(apart of the 2 Thes. 2 Great Falling Away) 
    It is amazing to watch the mental gymnastics legalists and cultists go through in justifying everything Herb did.   Jesus no more told HWA to call the church "worldwide" than he told him to call the church "Radio."


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  • 02/04/17--10:24: Getting Sodom Straighter

  • "It’s interesting—Lot was also protected right where he was by angels. (I think this is the main point.  Dave is not going to want to "flee" and leave his stuff behind, so maybe they can be protected in their homes . However, since all the members have taken out the equity in their homes and sent it in, and not to worry, "Frankly before it becomes due, we flee",  I could be mistaken) It was a very perverse city. There were a lot of homosexuals who saw these two beautiful young men. I mean, angels wouldn’t have come and been ugly, they would have been attractive or handsome, we’ll say, and they come into Lot’s house. And there are a couple of interesting things about the story…many interesting things about the story, but one of them is they demanded that Lot send these two men out.
    Well, he first tried his daughters, his married daughters. It shows that God’s servants can make mistakes, brethren, and it ought to encourage you.  (Meaning:  I have made big mistakes and even though I don't admit to them and that should make you feel good when you do). The Bible calls Lot a just man, but the first thing he tried to do to satisfy these homosexuals is to send his daughters out to commit adultery…Not the best thing to do when you’re threatened…and yet God still let him escape…still let them escape.
    By the way, they did some terrible things after they got out…but that is kind of an aside. The angels protected him where he was, in the home he was in; used miracles to create blindness to keep the people outside from getting in and just sealed them in the home. They escaped before they left the city and fled to Zoar. It’s an interesting story. It also is instructive for those who think that to be like Sodom and Gomorrah everybody has to be perverse or homosexual. Well, no they don’t. There are a lot of problems with that. (Yes there are. I think he gets this)
    First of all, Lot was married to a woman, and his daughters were both married to men who mocked and wouldn’t leave. They said, “No, you’re crazy,” and they died the next day. So you had three heterosexual people, who are cited there in the community, and presumably we all believe that there were men and women all through the…all through the city who came about by the usual means, okay?"(Okay!  On this point I think you see more clearly than most COG ministers.  No city is all gay in the Middle East, ever!)
    Apostle David C Pack
    Screed # 61

    Less heat?

    Let's get Sodom straight....

    The Biblical story of Sodom is not the story of a town that happened to be 100% gay, men and boys, for this is a ludicrous assumption. This would have to be the conclusion if God, vowing to save it for ten righteous men, did not. It would also mean that "righteous" meant heterosexual, while unrighteous meant homosexual and, well, I doubt that alone qualifies men to be righteous.
    The story that unfolds in Genesis 19 is a hospitality story and not a story based on homosexuality. Sodom's problems as remembered by Ezekiel were that the people were prideful, had too much food, too much time, neglected the poor, were haughty and committed abominations (Ez. 16:49-50). Not ANY mention of mass homosexuality. Abominations can be just about anything not in tune with the law and in this case was a reference to idol worship. Another common Israelite trait all through their history. 

    Why would papa Lot offer his virgin daughter's to a crowd of homosexuals, in place of his guests? What interest would homosexuals have in virgin women? ZERO, unless the girls were being offered as an appeasing virgin sacrifice ("for they have not known a man.") This would qualify as an abomination to be sure, and also idolatry. Human sacrifice was still an option it appears with Abram and Lot. Just a thought....
    Another factor is that in that culture the protection of guests under one's roof to a male host was a matter of honor. This is why Lot scrambled to come up with a solution to the problem. In Lot's mind, it was about Lot's reputation and honor. Not an uncommon modern theme in Middle Eastern men to this day. Strangers were not taken kindly to in small clannish towns. They could be spies and were always suspect.
    The way to put a stranger in his place was to humiliate them sexually, and send the warning that they had best have no ill intentions in the town. In that culture, the most horrific way to humiliate a stranger and have power over him was to mistreat him as one might mistreat a woman. Symbolic or literal rape. The rape would not be a homosexual act, it would be a warning and a putting of strange man in his place as a warning. "In our town, you are just like any other woman, property to be used as needed and disposed of if necessary" It may only have been a threat to humiliate and control as the original request was for them to come out "that we might know them".
    There are two schools of thought on "know them". One is sexual and one is to simply interrogate and get to know. Few ever question Lot's evil counteroffer. But it does show that Lot was a product of his culture and personal ego protection. Eastern hospitality issues were at stake here and not homosexuality. EVERY sermon I ever heard on the topic stops short of explaining Lot's egregious behavior as a father. I doubt this ever really literally happened, but if it did, Lot would be no hero of mine. I seriously doubt he had much of a relationship with the girls after this stunt, not to mention Mrs. Lot! Perhaps she did not so much look back to Sodom as refused to look ahead at him leaving town.

    And no one literally turned into a pillar of salt

    Ezekiel 16 is all about Israel acting the part of adulterous woman and prostitute and concludes with:

    Ezekiel 16: 49 “‘Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: 
    She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; 
    they did not help the poor and needy.
    50 They were haughty and did detestable things before me. 
    Therefore I did away with them as you have seen. 
    51 Samaria did not commit half the sins you did. 
    You have done more detestable things than they, 
    and have made your sisters seem righteous by all these things you have done. 
    52 Bear your disgrace, for you have furnished some justification for your sisters. 
    Because your sins were more vile than theirs, they appear more righteous than you. 
    So then, be ashamed and bear your disgrace, 
    for you have made your sisters appear righteous.

    No totally gay town here to see.

    Keep moving please.

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